Go O'L Grey Market Debate.

[Roosta]

:confused013

I finally have decided to buy my UWA. So it was a neck and neck between the Canon 10-20, Sigma 10-20 and the Tokina 12-24mm.

Read all the main sites, checked the reviews and read up on AP regs reports and asked through PM'S.

The Tokina seems to have one my battle of the UWA'S, So I send an e-mail the Tokina Importer in Australia and asked for a retailer-re-seller in Western Australia.

This is some excert from the e-mail I recieved. (Names removed Beside mine)

"Hi Anthony,

Thank you for your email. We are the Tokina distributor in Australia but unfortunately we don't get any stock from Tokina at the moment.

The best is to purchase a Tokina lens from overseas at the moment. We are able to service your lens in Australia to normal warranty conditions. Please send a proof of purchase from a licensed Leica dealer together with you repair.

Best regards,

Yeap no worries, Licensed Lecia dealer OVERSEAS. Got that.

So I page dumped this link into a reply e-mail (http://www.dwidigitalcameras.com.au/store/advsearch.asp?action=search&keyword=tokina+) And got this as a reply,

"Tokina has got an international warranty. You can get your Tokina lens service under normal warranty conditions here in Australia.

Our biggest issue is getting stock from Tokina and getting the goods to our resellers. Price matching is not an issue for us at the moment.

Best regards,
#####

##### ###### | Marketing Department | adeal Pty Ltd | 2 Baldwin Road, Altona North, VIC 3025
Phone: 03 8369 4422 | Fax: 03 8369 4440 | www.adeal.com.au

Well blow me down, I contacted a Pro Tog shop here in WA and the best they can come up with is 2 1/2 times that price on DWI. Also a site sponsor in WA has the old lens listed at nearly double the DWI price.

Now, I'm all for the aussie buying, but what do you do when the Australian supplier says that?

Love to hear what you AP regs think.

[kiwi]

ridiculous

[Scotty72]

More than twice the price?

Very easy decision

[Dark Mist]

G'day,
it's unbelievable that the wholesaler would point you to purchase O/S.
I would take the advice from any online sellers with a big pinch of salt though. "International Warranty" is worth exactly the same as the paper it's printed on. I have never heard of anyone honouring the warranty here or overseas except in the case of international travellers who buy their stuff duty free and have yet to return home.

Online stores will tell you different but here's an extract from CR Kennedy's website:
Please Note

1) CR Kennedy & Company Pty Ltd does not provide any warranty or guarantee for parallel /grey imports. We will not honour any warranty or guarantee supplied by parallel importers such as www.camerasdirect.com.au, www.d-d.photographics.com.au, www.dwidigitalcameras.com.au, www.dwidigitalcameras.com.au and www.globalmediapro.com.

SIGMA AUSTRALIAN WARRANTY ON GREY IMPORTS

C.R. Kennedy & Co P/L will only undertake warranty repairs on products sourced through us. All products imported directly from overseas and resold are not covered by our warranty. This includes purchases through eBay or through grey importers such as www.camerasdirect.com.au, www.d-d-photographics.com.au, www.DealsDirect.com.au, www.globalmediapro.com, www.photobuff.com.au and www.topbuy.com.au.

Mark Harrison from www.camerasdirect.com.au has been directly advised by Sigma Japan that C.R. Kennedy, the only authorised Sigma agent in Australia, will not cover warranty on Sigma products bought through www.camerasdirect.com.au

We will attempt to match, through our authorised Sigma dealer network, any legitimate advertised internet price on Sigma lenses by these grey importers.ﾠThese prices do not include traditional pre-sales and after sales service normally given by your local retail store. We suggest that you research the product thoroughly before making any purchase.

[Kym]

CRK are very good. I've had an issue with my K-5 and it will be replaced.
I got my K-5 local within $70 of my landed cost from OS.
The Sigma price match (brings the price within cooee of the Grey item) is very good.

Too bad Canikon won't do the same.

[Roosta]

I hear what your saying, re warranty. I'm a very cautious, but some AP regs have brought from DWI and the like and have nothing bad to say. I did just read under the Canon forum re a possible warranty issue with a grey lens, and the comments re (Citiwide).

But what I got from the Australian imported is as is, their website mentions International warranty, but isn't very clear. The C R Kennedy statement is Black and White, no arguements here.

I really like this little lens, but the warranty issue? (The company rep only mentioned that it had to be purchased at a Lecia Dealer Is DWI ??) But why put faith in a company (Closet was Singapore) that i've never heard off?

I don't get it. Stock is available in Western Australia, but they didn't even dirrect me (when I clearly asked) for a WA Re-Seller/Retailer?

Might buy the Sigma just over this, DWI is at AUD $509.00 and the closet AUD Aussie supplied is over twice that for the older model, thats off a WA AP Sponsor site ???

[Roosta]

CRK are very good. I've had an issue with my K-5 and it will be replaced.
I got my K-5 local within $70 of my landed cost from OS.
The Sigma price match (brings the price within cooee of the Grey item) is very good.

Too bad Canikon won't do the same.

Sorry to here about the Body you'd been waiting for Kym, for me the issue is more to the point the way the Importer points out to use O/S or DWI.

CRK, well, they are backing the Aussie supplier and full qudos to them for that, just can't get my Tokina through them, Bummer.

Sigma is looking better each mo, and the Canon.

[geoffsta]

Well... I took my sigma 150-500mm to CRKennedy over a fortnight ago. (Had to stop car suddenly, and lens rolled off back seat. AF, OS and aperture not to good)
I told them that it was a grey import, and I didn't expect any warranty. They said that they would ring me on the Monday and let me know. Jan 31st.
I waited a week, then rang them. A bloke then told me that that technicians would ring me that afternoon... that was the 7th of Feb and still no call. :(
I will ring them again tomorrow. I hope to get better service then, but won't hold my breath. :confused013

[I @ M]

Geoff, I don't think that the grey import factor even enters into your case.
If your lens had been a locally purchased one there would have been no recourse on your behalf to claim warranty repairs because as far as i know there aren't many if any manufacturers ( from camera gear to bulldozers ) that will repair accident damage under a warranty claim.
I have had nothing less than superb service from C R Kennedy when they have repaired a couple of lenses, both were bought secondhand and one was a grey import ( the first thing that C R Kennedy do is to check the serial number/s against their database ) but seeing as the job was a paying one for them they don't care where the lens came from.

[ving]

getting harder and harder to justify buying local...

[brindyman]

my reply would be have you thought of the tokina 11 - 16 f2.8 :rolleyes:


but then i read your post again and i was like.............### :eek: thats pretty stupid

[tcdev]

I've bought 2x DSLR and 3x lenses through the grey import market. Thankfully I haven't had any warranty issues (yet)!

My personal feeling on the whole "buy Aussie" argument is this; for a very very long time we've been held to ransom with high freight and unjustifiably high margins. But the world is getting smaller, and with online retailing and falling freight costs there really is no justification for prices double-and-more those of overseas. I'd support local retailers if they weren't ripping us off, but they are. Even if you argue that it's also the overseas manufacturers contributing, I'm still not willing to bend over and take it simply because of someone else's greed.

One of my favourite sayings is "Vote with your feet". Nothing will change until we, the consumer, simply refuse to put up with it. Gerry Harvey can cry poor all he likes, but the simple fact is that his business needs to move with the times and recognise that in today's world you need to be competitive on a global scale, or get the hell out of the business. The only way that will happen is if people stop paying obscene prices and take their business elsewhere. It's unfortunate for the local workforce, but the alternative is that we all end up paying through the nose to subsidise local wages and line Gerry's pockets. And that makes me angry.

[geoffsta]

Oh yes.. Easterly said. But will you take a substantial pay cut, so that the Gerry Harveys of this world don't have to charge as much? Will you "vote with your feet" to decrease insurance, power and other utilities? Will you say "no" to your boss when it comes to him paying your superannuation?
It is we that have made the Gerry Harvey's of this world charge so much. It is we that make to prices of houses so expensive that our younger generation cannot afford the great Aussie dream.
Get your head out of the clouds, and think logically.

[gerry]

getting harder and harder to justify buying local...



I'd support local retailers if they weren't ripping us off, but they are.

One of my favourite sayings is "Vote with your feet". Nothing will change until we, the consumer, simply refuse to put up with it.

Be carefully not accuse the 'local retailer', you may well find its not them, they are at the mercy of the australian importers of which there only a few.

I agree when prices are this ridiculus (2.5X) then questions need to be raised.

The time to support local retailers is now - just check the prices for the D700, D7000 and a few others - plenty of melbourne and syndey stores match and better the grey prices on these right now, with aussie stock and warranty.



In terms of the UWA options you are looking at you just need to weigh up the options based on possible warranty claim, initial purchase cost and make your decision, everyone will be different. However at 2.5X the nearest local retailer I know which I would get :th3:

[arthurking83]

.... just check the prices for the D700, D7000 and a few others - plenty of melbourne and syndey stores match and better the grey prices on these right now, with aussie stock and warranty.



.....

They do? :confused:

[tcdev]

Get your head out of the clouds, and think logically.
I'm not sure whether it's my ignorance, or your bad grammar, but I'm afraid I have no idea what argument you're putting forward? :confused013

[gerry]

They do? :confused:

yep! check out this thread (http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?78277-Substantial-Discounts)

(and no, I have no affliation with ANY importer or local retailer)

[ricktas]

yep! check out this thread (http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?78277-Substantial-Discounts)

(and no, I have no affliation with ANY importer or local retailer)

HUH, this thread is about an UWA lens, and the linked thread is about Nikon Camera bodies. Sorry, but that is like comparing pots and kettles:D

[gerry]

HUH, this thread is about an UWA lens, and the linked thread is about Nikon Camera bodies. Sorry, but that is like comparing pots and kettles:D

The title of the thread is 'Go O'L Grey Market Debate.'

I agree its about an UWA, but its not completely unrelated, additionally its a thread I was familiar with and was more of a response to arthurking83's post.

If its that left field feel free to remove. :)

[Bennymiata]

If you guys think we are being ripped off by the local camera and lens importers, check out what many cars cost overseas, then compare those prices in Oz.

A big problem we have over here is the cost of the overheads here in Oz.
It costs about the same to rent a warehouse in Sydney or in the US, with the US probably being a bit cheaper, and the minimum, legal, wage rate in the USA is only $7.50 per hour (as against $19 or so here), and seeing that their population is 15 times ours - and so their sales, our poor importers have the same if not more overheads ot contend with, yet our sales are very small in comparison to most other countries.
Sure, Hong Kong only has a relatively small population compared to ours, but they sell almost as many cameras over there as they do in the US. Hence their cheap prices.
I can't say this for sure, but I would imagine that as our camera importers buy in much smaller quantities than the US or Europe for example, then they will be paying a higher price from the manufacturers overseas too - which only compounds the problem.

Many politicians, from both sides of the equation, will tell you that if an industry is inefficient, it should die, and if the imports are eating away at the local stuff either the importers will die or they wil reduce their prices to compete.

Be thankful that we can import our stuff from sellers overseas, as people buying cars don't have that luxury, because if you try and import a new, or near new car, and it doesn't have an Australian compliance plate on it, you'll never get it registered. I'm so glad that doesn't apply to cameras!

[ricktas]

A big problem we have over here is the cost of the overheads here in Oz.
It costs about the same to rent a warehouse in Sydney or in the US, with the US probably being a bit cheaper, and the minimum, legal, wage rate in the USA is only $7.50 per hour (as against $19 or so here),

Ummm, not exactly correct. The minimum wage for an ADULT (over 18) in Australia in 2011 is $569.90 per week (before tax), or $15 per hour (as rounded to the nearest 10 cents). Australian's aged over 13 years and 8 months can seek work with most employers, and their rate does not have to meet this $15.00 per hour minimum, so it is quite easy to get people working for less than $15.00 an hour.

[reaction]

if a grey can send stock from HK, then the Oz distributor can send stock from HK at the same price.
so you add GST, postage to retailer, some retailer stocking fees.

since retailers hardly stock more than 2 copies, I don't know why the cost is so great.

anyway, at least for Tokina you can use a Licensed dealer OVERSEAS. Some brands you can't.

[Philip Smith]

I recently purchased a Nikon GP-1 unit for an overseas supplier. With UPS freight it came to about Aust $240. The best I could find from a reputable dealer in Australia was about $450. It is grey market but I am willing to take a chance on 12 months warranty for the $200 saving.

I also dropped into a well-known store in Canberra today. A two-axis Hama hotshoe bubble level was $52! Give me a break. I bought three-axis level in London for less than $10.

I am all for supporting local stores but not if the price differences are 100% or more.

Having said that, there are some great stores in Melbourne that I frequent and buy the odd lens from at reasonable prices.