7D Sharpness Issues

[TAYLORW619]

Hi all,

With my 7D, I just can't get sharp photos :confused013 :(

It's really annoying me because I spent so much on the camera.

Here is an example image, would it be motion blur? But it is at a shutter of 1/100. PP has been applied, including sharpening.

Thanks,
Taylor

http://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk330/TAYLORW619/IMG_0030.jpg

[Art Vandelay]

That doesn't look 'that' bad. but could be improved

What lens ?

Which AF mode are you using ?

Is that cropped or full frame ?

[TAYLORW619]

Using my new 24-105L f/4 IS.

I was using Manual select AF point expansion mode.

Focused on his right eye.

Slightly cropped on the right side.

When zoomed in on the eye, not sharp at all.

[Scotty72]

Mate to be honest, whilst it should be ok, 1/100 isn't all that fast if if have an unsteady hand. If you were at 1/500 and still having blur then, I would start blaming the camera.

Not meaning to be rude (I have no idea of your experience) but are you sure you are not moving the camera when you press the button?

Use the same settings in close to the same conditions but put the camera on a tripod (or resting on table) and take a pic using the 10 sec timer. See what happens.

Scotty


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TAYLORW619]

Mate to be honest, whilst it should be ok, 1/100 isn't all that fast if if have an unsteady hand. If you were at 1/500 and still having blur then, I would start blaming the camera.

Not meaning to be rude (I have no idea of your experience) but are you sure you are not moving the camera when you press the button?

Use the same settings in close to the same conditions but put the camera on a tripod (or resting on table) and take a pic using the 10 sec timer. See what happens.

Scotty


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hi Scotty,

No offence taken at all, your trying to help so I appreciate that.

I think I need to be conscious of how steady I am holding the camera and how I am holding it. Does everyone agree with this? How am I supposed to be holding if so?

[Art Vandelay]

With the manual select AF mode, have you set up the little joystick to move the point around with your thumb ? if not do that. I can't remember if it had to be enabled in the menu.

Looking at that pic again. focal length is 105mm & shutter 1/100. That should be OK with the IS but it looks it may have caught a a bit of motion blur when you notice the rows of bricks in the background. You will still get some duds even with the IS

Got a couple more to post up ?

[TAYLORW619]

With the manual select AF mode, have you set up the little joystick to move the point around with your thumb ? if not do that. I can't remember if it had to be enabled in the menu.

Looking at that pic again. focal length is 105mm & shutter 1/100. That should be OK with the IS but it looks it may have caught a a bit of motion blur when you notice the rows of bricks in the background. You will still get some duds even with the IS

Got a couple more to post up ?

Yes that is the correct mode, I always usually use the centre point as it is the strongest (so I have been told).

I kind of forget how I held the camera, but I don't remember breathing in before taking the photo.

I don't have anymore to post.

Thanks,
Taylor

[Scotty72]

The shutter speed / focal length rule of thumb is just that. Consider it a bare minimum for hand-held.

Also, don't forget the 7d is a crop camera so 100mm is 160mm for the purpose of this argument. So, I'd be looking at more like 1/160 min.

Simplest way to work around this is, put your 7d into 8fps mode and take 3 or 4 shots in rapid succession (hold the button down). If you take 3, the middle one should be ok.

Scotty


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kym]

How do you hold your camera?

http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?t=24043

How are you activating the shutter? I.e. do you roll your finger or jab?

[kiwi]

jeepers creepers

how about doing a simple focus test

camera on triopd, use flash, s/s 1/250s, fixed target at different focal lengths and distances

shooting people hand held at lowish shutter speeds and blaming the camera on focus issues aint really fair

[Wayne]

I agree with Kiwi, you have to try again in good light, using the AF to focus on something with the camera resting on a tripod or still rest like a table, wall etc and use the self timer to trigger the shutter.. Just be sure to do it in a controlled environment, ie; not outside in wind.

[TAYLORW619]

How do you hold your camera?

http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?t=24043

How are you activating the shutter? I.e. do you roll your finger or jab?

Would you say the best bet is to try hold correctly, roll finger and use burst?




I am not necessarily blaming the camera, thats why I brought up the slow shutter :rolleyes: I have read about the 7D being soft though, but I am not experienced enough to make a judgement call yet.

Thanks for everyones help thus far.

[Kym]

Would you say the best bet is to try hold correctly, roll finger and use burst?

Burst is irrelevant.
There is a knurled bit of the shutter release so you can roll your finger off that onto the shutter release gently without shaking.

http://kelbytv.com/dtowntv/2010/04/01/episode-36/ The bit you want starts 3 minutes into the vid

[jbee]

Hi I have a 7d too and was finding some lack of sharpness at 200mm handheld but yesterday when I was photographing a wallaby in the garden I noticed that I was having trouble holding the focus point over it's eye steadily and as I pressed the shutter the camera moved slightly right each time, so I am getting a tripod, as that's just me, like gun shooters some have very steady hands and some don't , I am one that doesn't. I think a tripod will help a lot for me. I know it's not the camera because I have had some very sharp photo's from it.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kym]

@jbee - I guessing it's camera holding technique + shutter technique

[Old Skool]

First off I would do test shots on a tripod to micro-adjust the lens to your camera. Then do some more test shots to determine what your lens aperture "sweet" spot is. Then you are ready to start shooting.

[TAYLORW619]

Ok thanks Kym,

I will watch the video a few times, read the link a few times and then post back results and maybe include a few images.

I am getting a battery grip soon so hopefully that will help me.

Thanks,
Taylor

[peterking]

Evening Taylor.
Man how I sympathise with you.
I hate to think how much grief my 7D gave me when I got it.
A few points.
1. On your shot you say the focus was on his right eye but it is his left eye that has the sharpest focus. I suspect that there has been some camera movement as jbee mentioned. I found this to be a major factor for me.
2. Definitely agree with Scotty about the speed and the tripod. I had to forget about 1/100 unless on a tripod. The 7d is a fast camera and wants to work fast and hard. Move your speeds up and try not going below 1/250.
3. Don't use burst. Unless you are working at 1/500 or faster the camera movement, from my experience, will be the same or worse.

I personally don't use manual select AF. This is something I may use when I get back to the sports shooting. I have found this (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=3049) article useful. Also this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-K8MP1HFnE) was also useful.

The major thing I have found with the 7D is that it is a fast camera and wants to work fast. If you want to work slow you need a tripod. So, fast shutter speeds, fast lenses (you got), and lots of light.

[TAYLORW619]

Evening Taylor.
Man how I sympathise with you.
I hate to think how much grief my 7D gave me when I got it.
A few points.
1. On your shot you say the focus was on his right eye but it is his left eye that has the sharpest focus. I suspect that there has been some camera movement as jbee mentioned. I found this to be a major factor for me.
2. Definitely agree with Scotty about the speed and the tripod. I had to forget about 1/100 unless on a tripod. The 7d is a fast camera and wants to work fast and hard. Move your speeds up and try not going below 1/250.
3. Don't use burst. Unless you are working at 1/500 or faster the camera movement, from my experience, will be the same or worse.

I personally don't use manual select AF. This is something I may use when I get back to the sports shooting. I have found this (http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=3049) article useful. Also this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-K8MP1HFnE) was also useful.

The major thing I have found with the 7D is that it is a fast camera and wants to work fast. If you want to work slow you need a tripod. So, fast shutter speeds, fast lenses (you got), and lots of light.

Hi Peter,

When I mean that it is focus on his right eye, I mean the right eye from OUR perspective, so from his perspective left eye. Is this the eye you don't think is in focus? I think the eye on our right is the sharpest.

Also just a quick note, does anybody think I have over processed the image? I have recently been playing with levels, curves etc. in Aperture 3.

Thanks,
Taylor

[acko]

How do you hold your camera?

http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?t=24043

How are you activating the shutter? I.e. do you roll your finger or jab?

As I do a lot of competition shooting, I activate the shutter just as I do with a trigger - a slow deliberate action. Push for a shutter, pull for a trigger.

Even so.....I too have the 24-105 L lens, and cured slight blurring by upping the shutter speed.

[trigger]

Hey mate. had a look at that image and it doesnt seems like camera shake at all.
looks like is back focused. The hair and the collar look in focus?

1. If you manually selected the AF point with expansion its probably focused on the areas of the collar or hair as its higher contrast

2. If its not the AF did you do mirco adjustments to the lens? If so you better check it out.

3. Did you focus and recompose? was it one shot AF? if thats the case then might have moved after your recomposed.

[TAYLORW619]

So I shouldn't use expansion and just use single point?

[TAYLORW619]

I think it is motion blur, look zoomed in on eye brows.

[Kym]

Taylor...you provoked this http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?p=664014#post664014 ;)

Enjoy!

[TAYLORW619]

Taylor...you provoked this http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?p=664014#post664014 ;)

Enjoy!

Jesus Christ your dedicated.

Thanks for that though, If I have any questions I'll ask :)

Thanks

[Kym]

Jesus Christ your dedicated.

He's much cooler than me. But that aside, its something we needed in NTP anyway :D

[RaoulIsidro]

I can see your reflection on his left eye.
It doesn't look like motion blurr.
The stiches on his blue collar are not very defined.
Perhaps you could do a lens sharpness test.

[TAYLORW619]

I can see your reflection on his left eye.
It doesn't look like motion blurr.
The stiches on his blue collar are not very defined.
Perhaps you could do a lens sharpness test.

How exactly do I do it?

I have tried, but I just am hopeless at it.

[Kym]

How exactly do I do it?
I have tried, but I just am hopeless at it.

What Kiwi posted above.

Tripod + Mirror Up + Fast Shutter speed + Accurate focus

[RaoulIsidro]

Try this:
Get a crisply defined bar code, the bigger the better. The ones on computer boxes are great.
Set the box and bar code plane at a 45 degree and about 1 mt from the camera.
Set your camera and lens on a tripod.
Set your lens to MF.
Set the centre AF point directly on the centre of the bar code.
Press live view and try to focus.
Press the zoom button to focus further. (X5)
Press the zoom button once more for (X10) magnification.
Get the best and harpest contrasty image and take the picture.
Do this on all focal lengths.

Review the images on the monitor.
The sharpest images should be on the centre and blurring on both sides.
If you are not happy with the sharpness, show this image to the Canon Service.
They might charge you about $50.00 if they find nothing wrong.
Cheers!

[TAYLORW619]

I'll try get a chart off the net or something.

If I can't get it right I'll just have to send it back to Whilton or somebody to calibrate.

[RaoulIsidro]

I'll try get a chart off the net or something.

If I can't get it right I'll just have to send it back to Whilton or somebody to calibrate.

If the issue is lens sharpness, perhaps Canon Service at North Ryde would be a better option. They have their own courier service provider. Best to call them to confirm the problem.
Self testing the lens for sharpness would be a good idea and prerequisite.
All the best.:)

[Art Vandelay]

We need more pics.

Half a dozen potential solutions from 1 sample pic is going to get confusing.

Did you try the pics suggested in your other thread ?

[TAYLORW619]

What do you mean pics in my other thread?

[TAYLORW619]

Just did a test, but not sure if I did it correctly.

Here are the results.

0
http://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk330/TAYLORW619/IMG_0303.jpg

+5
http://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk330/TAYLORW619/IMG_0305.jpg

+6
http://i308.photobucket.com/albums/kk330/TAYLORW619/IMG_0310.jpg

[TAYLORW619]

Seems pointless doing the micro adjustment, every time I do it I get different results :confused013:rolleyes:

[Art Vandelay]

Didn't it error again and you were swapping it over for a 5d mkiii anyway ?

[TAYLORW619]

Well sent it back and they couldn't get the problem to occur and sent to their repairer to test.

Has come back since monday and have not had any problems since, I have not used the camera much though.

If the error comes again I must take a photo of the screen for evidence.

[arthurking83]

That's why many experts recommend not to do them in this manner to begin with.. it can be a bit misleading.

try to do it with real targets in what can be described(loosely) as a real life situation.

first up, the biggest problem with using AF adjustment in camera with a zoom lens, is that it affects all focal lengths in the zoom range. You may actually find that if there is any focus accuracy issues, it's not usually for the entire zoom range but may be limited to only the longest focal length setting, or maybe a small range at one end.

eg. 105mm many be inaccurate, but at 24mm may be perfect. If you micro adjust for better accuracy @ 105mm, then accuracy will be up the creek at 24mm!
(this is a slight nuisance with my 28-75mm f/2.8)

A much better AF accuracy test setup is something like this:

http://www.ausphotography.net.au/staff/AK83/DSD_9066_FOCUS%20TEST.jpg

OK, it's not one of those $500 focus checker test rigs, but everyone has 5 or 7 AA batteries lying around their house somewhere(raid all the remotes for AAA's if you have too, but AA's are better)

Set them up like this making sure that each battery so that the next line of batteries back is starting where the closest batter(y)(ies) finishes off.. if you need to use something like a sheet of paper to try to keep the gap between front line and next line back to a minimum then do so. It's not important that you maintain a millimeter perfect tolerance, just that you need to keep some sense of distance perspective. You also need to be pretty accurate in making sure that the camera/lens is quite square on to the line of batteries too. ie. if you angle the lens at 45° to the triangle of batteries, you going to induce user created DOF issues too. Doesn't have to be perfect, you're not measuring lens resolution!.. just checking to see if there is any problem with the focusing accuracy with your lens/camera combination. It can and does happen, but is not as common as folks think it is.

My guess is that you won't have a big AF accuracy problem... but that's just a guess.
You need a tripod, and you're best advised to use mirror lockup and remote and so forth, but it's not 100% necessary, shooting in burst mode can be as effective. faster shutter speeds tho will help too. Remember you're not measuring MTF of the lens, your trying to work out if the lens is sharp, where is it sharp. You'll also need to setup the camera that it's pretty level relative to the batteries, and not looking up to them, or down on them too.

Note in my image, there's a drawn in box and cross.

the box is where the AF pointer was set too. that's the size and shape of the AF square and how it's set against the scene. it's important.. vitally important not to confuse the AF system with lots of lines of contrast to focus on.
While there are other printable focus test charts like the one you got there that have decently presented areas for the focus system to lock onto, it seems to me the one you've used is not quite a good example.
The multitude of lines in the test setup you've used can easily confuse the af system.. even if the af square is only 'seeing' one of those horizontal lines in your diagonal setup.
The crosses in the square indicate where the actual af sensor lines should be set to by the manufacturer. no one really knows how accurately the manufacturer has set the vf/af/optical system within the vf you can see, and there's no guarantee that the actual sensors will be perfectly set within the AF square. The vertical line on the cross reads the horizontal contrast for the focus system, and the horizontal line in the cross reads the vertical contrast to get an af lock.
It's been known on various places around the net, that these cross sensors are not always dead centre in the AF square, hence why it's important to have room around the AF square so that nothing else can confuse the AF system.. otherwise you may get variable results.

note how the AF square in the battery test setup is only seeing the centre battery.
(note this is not my idea, but something I stumbled on somewhere on the net thanks to someone else that found it from someone else.. etc.etc...)

this image was from the Nikon 80-200/2.8, which I subsequently found out has a long standing issue with backfocusing at about a 4 meter focus distance!! :confused: the issue is that specific,and only happens at 200mm! My test was done at about 3.75m focus distance, as that's how big my kitchen is :p

note how the line of two batteries behind the central one look sharper ? :th3:

that's because the lens backfocuses at this range/focal length. the green text shows where the best most contrasty area is, and seems to indicate that the lens backfocuses by the thickness of one AA battery.... what's that, about 2cm?..... 17mm or so, I just checked.

quick DOF check

using a DOF checker/calculator(to estimate some DOF calculations)

3.75 m

Depth of field
Near limit 3.73 m
Far limit 3.77 m
Total 0.04 m

In front of subject 0.02 m (50%)
Behind subject 0.02 m (50%)

Hyperfocal distance 707.3 m
Circle of confusion 0.02 mm

OK, this kind'a proves a couple of things.. that the DOF calculator need to produce a readout to three decimal places :p and that, it's kind'a accurate for this application too.

I see acceptable sharpness at the same line(of writing) on the front battery, as on the green line area I've marked on that second row of batteries.

But the front of the front battery(where it says DSE) is definitely out of whack and blurry, right there where focus should have been.

I then set AF micro adjust to +15 and the lens focused a lot better at this range and at this focal length, but ruined it for the rest of the focal length and focus distance range.
The lens(taken in with the camera too) needed to be recalibrated, I just never got around to it, and then subsequently sold it off.
But you can see that the lens is very sharp at f/2.8 and I never doubted that.. when I wanted uber sharp images at f/2.8(for artistic purposes), I'd use Live View for focus confirmation(which is dead spot on ever time! :th3:).. or shoot as per Scotty's advice above.. lots of frames, (I'd)sway my entire body back just a tad, to counter the backfocusing lens.. and eventually one in two or three images would turn out sharp and usable.
Never use focus with the shutter release, and only with the AF-On button, and use continuous drive focusing. Focus only when you need too, as you need too(not because the camera tells you that you must!!) use your thumb on the AF-On button and you focus, and then not, and then focus again to keep the lens focusing and adjusting. Sounds like a lot of arsing about, but in the end it wasn't... and it usually worked well.

[TAYLORW619]

So I basically need to send my camera and lens's away to get them fixed because of the inconsistencies throughout the whole range?

Thats a real pain because I won't be able to send mine off for a long time if I do, I have so much stuff coming up soon.

Thanks for that massive post! Really appreciate your time helping me!

[arthurking83]

So I basically need to send my camera and lens's away to get them fixed because of the inconsistencies throughout the whole range?....

Not necessellery! :p

If you do find, using an accurate test method, that the camera/lens does misfocus in a consistent manner, then you'd be wise to send it in for a calibration check/adjust, making sure that they only adjust the lens at this point. If you have other lenses, and they work perfectly, then if they adjust the camera(mechanically/electronically) then the other lenses then may be out too.

there's a pretty good paragraph or two about misfocusing lenses and how it kind of works in reality.. done by lensrental.com

Have a read of this when you have the time (http://www.lensrentals.com/news/2010.03.06/this-lens-is-soft-and-other-facts) .. it's worth it to understand what and why cameras and lenses misfocus.

In the case of the 80-200/2.8 lens of mine, this(misfocus) happened on every single attempt, unless I used LiveView to focus the lens at those parameters(focal length and focus distance). Otherwise the lens worked flawlessly.

Consistency is the key, if you get misfocus one day, but not on another, and you're locked the tripod down properly and made sure that the camera has been aligned correctly to the test target, and so forth, then I'd keep the gear and not send it in.
if one day, at a later point, you redo the testing and find that you've suddenly noticed that the testing is producing more consistent misofocusing results(you probably have figured out the key to getting consistent results!.. Do them one more time just to be sure, and then send in the gear to be properly calibrated(but before the warranty runs out.

Also note that I forgot to add into the previous text that you have to defocus the lens after every focus acquisition test shot. So focus, expose and then defocus the lens again before the next shot. I think I took about 10 images of this particular session. And when you defocus, do so in both directions, ie. both to infinity and, for the next test exposure to closest focus distance(MFD).

[agb]

Google canon 7d soft focus and hae a read of the threads on this issue. Seems very common.

[Arg]

I just got a 7D and the EFS 17-55 lens on Saturday and spent the weekend dealing with shots that were not at all sharp.

After initial sense of disappointment I started testing on Sunday and found that live view is pin sharp, but when using the default "19-point auto" viewfinder AF the focusing is all over the shop. It is *definitely not* focusing on the points that light up red in the viewfinder and on DPP. It appears to be focusing on the nearest object, even if it is on the edges of the frame (that's the whole frame, not the AF frame).

Changing VF AF to single point, the test subject near infinity suddenly became pin sharp identical to live view AF. Which was a great relief.

Unfortunately later that evening a bit of casual testing of dimly lit objects at 2-3m range with the pop-up flash providing focus assist, again provided a superior result with live view AF compared to single point VF AF, even though the VF AF is a smaller point. At least this time the VF AF was not too bad.

So initial strong disappointment on Saturday turned to strong relief this afternoon then to mild unease this evening.

More experimenting needed. But I must say the default AF mode is extremely disappointing.

[Art Vandelay]

What your finding is pretty normal. One of the biggest causes of concern with new 7d users around the net is having soft or out of focus images. Most times it's because the AF point mode used isn't doing what your expecting, not necessarily the camera doing someting wrong.


Default is the 19 point mode. Initially, change it to the single point for the time being and enable the thumb joystick to move it around the frame, that way 'you' pick where you want the focus, not the camera.

One of the simplest ways to get on top of all the af point and mode selections is to watch these videos, part 1,2 & 3.
Have the camera in your lap, pause it every now and then and go through the settings.


Videos (http://www.video.bhphotovideo.com?fr_search=7D&rf=bm)

Each of the AF point selection modes has their purpose, it's just a matter knowing which one suits the purpose at the time.

P.S. While you're in the menu settings, also enable the "spot AF" and "centre point expanded AF". After you get on top of it all, you'll probably end up using these more than any of the default settings.

You can alo download those videos onto your own computer or ipod.

[Clubmanmc]

I just got a 7D and the EFS 17-55 lens on Saturday and spent the weekend dealing with shots that were not at all sharp.

After initial sense of disappointment I started testing on Sunday and found that live view is pin sharp, but when using the default "19-point auto" viewfinder AF the focusing is all over the shop. It is *definitely not* focusing on the points that light up red in the viewfinder and on DPP. It appears to be focusing on the nearest object, even if it is on the edges of the frame (that's the whole frame, not the AF frame).

Changing VF AF to single point, the test subject near infinity suddenly became pin sharp identical to live view AF. Which was a great relief.

Unfortunately later that evening a bit of casual testing of dimly lit objects at 2-3m range with the pop-up flash providing focus assist, again provided a superior result with live view AF compared to single point VF AF, even though the VF AF is a smaller point. At least this time the VF AF was not too bad.

So initial strong disappointment on Saturday turned to strong relief this afternoon then to mild unease this evening.

More experimenting needed. But I must say the default AF mode is extremely disappointing.

yes, the auto AF is pretty average... i have been using the single point and the cross hair 5 point as each has its strengths, but the auto is very very average, due to it trying to guess too much as to what you are really trying to get sharp...

best to let the camera do less thinking for you and let it work on exposure...

M

[pnit]

This thread is a great read! I've had my 7d for a few days now (coming from a 30d) and I spent the first half day playing with the focus modes. I've reverted back to spot / user selected focus points, but I see there could be some uses for other modes, especially when tracking.

Since I've never had the chance to do microadjustments I decided to test all my lenses. This link shows a quick way to test your autofocus. Hope it's helpful.

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/article_pages/cameras/1ds3_af_micoadjustment.html

[jbee]

On the weekend I was playing with my remote release and the new tripod to get used to them, I was using LiveView for a change instead of the viewfinder because I wanted to try the 10x zoom on the screen in LiveView to see what bit was focused. I was using my 7d and 70-200 f4L.

I noticed that using the LiveView zoom what looked like a stable image was drifting around a bit, I checked all the tripod locks and ball head locks and all were tight. plus the tripod was outside on solid ground.

I went in to look through my manuals and the first one I read was the lens manual which said you MUST switch IS off when tripod mounted. So I went back out using the same settings and watched it with the IS on and it wandered, and Off and the image went rock solid.

I know for the experts this is obvious, but I think for any beginners out there like me it's worth sharing as there are that many settings on these things that there is a lot to take in at first and its easy to miss something. Maybe for some this might be a cause, especially on close range stuff, for the focus not being where you thought it was.

NB - you can only see this when using LiveView and zooming the Live View screen, just through the view finder it all looks steady

[mikew09]

Well, firstly I need to say I am only an amateur at photography and have travelled the path of sharpness issues too.

In my experience and I do not have the luxury of IS on my lenses - affortable thing :-)

Firstly, ensure you have run over the micro-adjust process with your lens in question. I did experience softness at times with my Tamron SP AF 17-50 and it was due to front focus - the focus point was about about 2" in front of the actual point of focus, hence I had a very similiar exsperience with portraits. Have only just corrected this and am astounded how much difference a +4 setting has made to this lens.

I mostly shoot with a 70-200L f4 USM (non IS). The basis here for me is shutter speed.
I set the aperture and then work the ISO to provide a shutter over 1/500 and very rarely do I have a focus issue. I admit I don't use this lens in really low light conditions so rarely is my iso to high to be an issue.

I am not convinced that your camera shake is that bad - take some shots with a high shutter speed and see if you have the same issue, micro-adjust and try again.

Cheers,

Mike

[Arg]

I just got a 7D and the EFS 17-55 lens on Saturday and spent the weekend dealing with shots that were not at all sharp....I started testing on Sunday and found that live view is pin sharp, but when using the default "19-point auto" viewfinder AF the focusing is all over the shop....

Here are a couple of pics with the 19-area auto AF mode. This is the 5th activation of the shutter, first the whole frame, showing the camera's chosen focus points in red, and second image a 100% close-up of the centre area. Exposure 1/250 at f4.5.

[pmack]

where on earth is that image actually in focus???

[Arg]

It's not too bad on the crack in the bottom right corner, ie not actually in focus but getting close.

Out of my first 44 images about 18 are like this, where the red points chosen by the camera for focus are blatantly nowhere even close. Others are really sharp - using the same focusing settings!

I just realised I may be hijacking the OP's thread? Let me know if my etiquette is bad, I'm still on topic with "7D sharpness issues" as per the thread title.

[agb]

Maybe have a look at these and then have another go.
http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=3167

[Arg]

[QUOTE=Clubmanmc;682930]yes, the auto AF is pretty average... i have been using the single point and the cross hair 5 point as each has its strengths, but the auto is very very average, due to it trying to guess too much as to what you are really trying to get sharp...best to let the camera do less thinking for you and let it work on exposure.../QUOTE]

When you say "auto AF is very very average", do you mean 18 complete duds out of 44 straightforward shots of static subjects? With the focusing points chosen by the camera not being even vaguely sharp?

[mikew09]

The AF looks confused to me and is trying to focus for al the AF points - I set my 50 to use a single AF point setting, never seen much need for allowing multi point auto focus, but that is just me.

[Art Vandelay]

Most of the EXIF data is missing.

What shutter speed ?

[Arg]

Maybe have a look at these and then have another go.
http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=3167

Thanks agb, but those videos concern more advanced AF features. I was just using the default 19-point focusing mode, and the subject matter was trivial: a static, high contrast detailed subject in the middle of the frame.

Art, as stated in my post with the pics, 1/250 sec at f4.5. Focal length 55mm, lens EFS 17-55.

Thanks for your interest. :th3:

[Art Vandelay]

arrh yes. I'm blind, my mistake sorry.

Is it getting proper focus in the other modes ?

[agb]

Thanks agb, but those videos concern more advanced AF features. I was just using the default 19-point focusing mode, and the subject matter was trivial: a static, high contrast detailed subject in the middle of the frame.

Art, as stated in my post with the pics, 1/250 sec at f4.5. Focal length 55mm, lens EFS 17-55.

Thanks for your interest. :th3:
I don't own a 7D, but I would if I did not continually read about focussing issues.
Is it possible there is a clue here?
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=36401804

[Arg]

Is it getting proper focus in the other modes ?

Yes, beautifully. Apart from a touch of microfocus adjustment being needed, but I can do that! :D

Part of me says ignore the poor focusing with 19-point AF, I'm not going to be using 19-point AF in my work flow and the more sophisticated modes work fine.

Other part of me says it just got harder for my dear wife to use the camera for occasional shots, and that *was* part of the plan for this camera. And hey, it's the *default* AF mode, you expect it to work on simple subject matter!

[Arg]

Is it possible there is a clue here?
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=36401804

Thanks agb, that was a thoughtful thread and makes good points. In the example given the camera was making a sensible decision based on good logic but the chosen focus point was a surprise to the photographer. That's fine, it happens!

In my example presented above on the 20th, no part of the frame is in focus. The camera chose several focus points (in red), but none of them are in focus nor is any average or weighted average distance.

Here is another example. The camera chose one focus point (red), so one expects that particular point to be in focus, but as you can see from the 100% crop, no part of that square is anywhere near to focus. In fact this example also has no part of the frame in focus. :Doh:

I have other examples where the actual focus point is in a corner of the frame nowhere near any of the 19 AF points, all of which are out of focus including the chosen red ones. Want to see one?

[jbee]

I never use 19 point AF with the Camera deciding which bit should be in focus and can't think when i ever would. If I'm taking a photo I know which bit I want in focus. I have no issues with my 7D at all. It's capable of way more than I can make use of. A great Camera.

[Art Vandelay]

Yes, beautifully. Apart from a touch of microfocus adjustment being needed, but I can do that! :D

Part of me says ignore the poor focusing with 19-point AF, I'm not going to be using 19-point AF in my work flow and the more sophisticated modes work fine.

Other part of me says it just got harder for my dear wife to use the camera for occasional shots, and that *was* part of the plan for this camera. And hey, it's the *default* AF mode, you expect it to work on simple subject matter!


For what it's worth, I doubt you'd ever use the 19 point default mode. Most don't seem to either. Mine is even disabled in the menu so it's quicker to flick through the ones I use... But that's not really the point. I agree, it should work. If you're getting good focus in other modes, and you've tested all possiblities in this mode and it's not just a couple of random misses, then you're best taking it back. That's what warranty's are for.

Just double check it's actually having time to get focus before you're pressing the shutter all the way down. Is it focusing in the view finder ? Out of interest, you may also narrow it down a bit and try it in AI servo as well as the one shot AF. If it's in AI servo it doesn't beep or highlight the focus point when it's got focus like it does in one shot mode.

[ving]

silly question, but whats the in camera sharpening set to and would this go part of the way to fixing the problem?

[Arg]

Hi David, I am using the standard picture style which has sharpening value of 3.

I have decided to get more photos under my belt, more experience with the camera/other lenses/ bigger database of photos to see if it is just plain bad at focusing in auto-area-select mode.

I especially tend to be aware that the single point focusing is working, so the focusing system itself is working and it is probably that the auto-area-select algorithms are not all that wonderful. I am a moderately advanced camera user and I will be using the more advanced AF modes for my photography, and they seem to be working to the extent I have used them so far.

Thanks to everyone for their input.