Does the B stand for bulb?

[Tannin]

You won't believe this, but I don't know how to use the "B" setting on my Canon cameras. Or, for that matter, on any other brand of camera. Until a few weeks ago, it simply wasn't something I had ever wanted or needed to do.

But lately I've been in some really dark rainforests, and a few night-time situations as well, and I've been pushing the 30-second maximum exposure that the camera can do in aperture priority mode. Or, if I remember correctly, in manual mode - which (I seem to recall) is the same. To get a correct exposure, I've had to up the ISO, where what I've really wanted to do was have a longer exposure - say, 45 seconds, f/16 100i.

I understand that BULB is the mode you use to do this. How does it work?

EDIT: I don't have a manual handy. I get better advice here anyway.

[DAdeGroot]

Yes B is for Bulb mode. You will require a remote. (well ok you can just hold the shutter down but expect camera movement).

In B mode, set you aperture and iso and then lock the shutter open with the remote. Close the shutter when you have exposed enough for your desired effect.

[Darey]

Tony,
For shutter times greater than 30sec you go into M manual mode and adjust the shutter speed to B U L B.
Now the shutter will stay open for as long as you press the shutter button.
It is recommended to use a remote shutter release because the shutter will then open on the first press of the remote button and remain open until you press the remote button again.

Hope that helps.

[Tannin]

Thanks Dave.

Ouch!

Not only do I not have a remote - the 10-second timer has always done everything I need - you mean I'm supposed to count seconds aloud or something? I don't wear a watch and in any case the reason I want more than 30 seconds is because it's dark, so how am I supposed to read it!

How extraordinarily primitive! Why on earth don't cameras have a way to say "45 seconds"?

Guess I'll just have to get used to it. And I imagine remotes cost a lot - I'll go and find out.

[Tannin]

Ouch!

The Canon ones are dear, and require plugging something into the sockets (which I dislike doing - it lets water and dust in).

There are a zillion off-brand things, some of them so cheap that I can't imagine them working well. (Prejudice.)

But hang on a second ...... is there a way to have the shutter open when you press, and stay open until you press again? In that case, a remote wouldn't be needed. You only need to use B when the exposure is more than 30 seconds, right? The vibration when you press the shutter on a tripod mounted camera (assume a decent tripod) is - what? One second? Something like that. So in (say) a 60 second exposure, the vibration affected part of it is less than 2% of the total, and you probably couldn't even see it.

Bet you there is no way to have the shutter stay open. :(

[Xenedis]

is there a way to have the shutter open when you press, and stay open until you press again?

Unfortunately not. The shutter won't be held open with only a button press; you'd have to hold the button, which would get really annoying if you were exposing for an hour.

Of course, there's the camera movement issue Dave mentioned.



In that case, a remote wouldn't be needed.


It is required.



You only need to use B when the exposure is more than 30 seconds, right?

Indeed.



The vibration when you press the shutter on a tripod mounted camera (assume a decent tripod) is - what? One second? Something like that. So in (say) a 60 second exposure, the vibration affected part of it is less than 2% of the total, and you probably couldn't even see it.

Ah, but you need to literally keep your finger on the button.



Bet you there is no way to have the shutter stay open. :(

Bet you're right.

If you're not keen on connecting a shutter release to the socket on the side of the camera, there may be some sort of third-party hotshoe-mounted wireless remote available somewhere; I've not looked into these.

[Tannin]

Thanks Xendis. A very quick and sloppy reading of the Canon blurb for the $800ish wireless remote says that it can go on the hotshoe. But that's overkill for my needs - I mean I've been using digital SLRs since 20D days and it's only recently that I've ever wanted more than 30 seconds. I mostly do birds. So overkill money-wise and clutter-wise - how much equipment should one person try to carry around?

But I am doing landscapes and things more and more lately ...

So what is a good, practical, cheapish, plug-in remote that is easy to use and ideally lets you key in (e,g.) 50 seconds?

[Shelley]

Ouch!

The Canon ones are dear, and require plugging something into the sockets (which I dislike doing - it lets water and dust in).

There are a zillion off-brand things, some of them so cheap that I can't imagine them working well. (Prejudice.)

But hang on a second ...... is there a way to have the shutter open when you press, and stay open until you press again? In that case, a remote wouldn't be needed. You only need to use B when the exposure is more than 30 seconds, right? The vibration when you press the shutter on a tripod mounted camera (assume a decent tripod) is - what? One second? Something like that. So in (say) a 60 second exposure, the vibration affected part of it is less than 2% of the total, and you probably couldn't even see it.

Bet you there is no way to have the shutter stay open. :(

Tony I have a Hahnel Pro Remote Control (which i have used when birding - had to hide and set it of remotely - up to 80 metres). It works very well - took me awhile to work the darn thing out because of stupid instructions - which were useless. It cost $70 from my local camera shop. Probably could get even cheaper online. I didn't want to pay the price of the canon one - for what I wanted to use it for. There is another brand - can't think of it, for the life of me. It was worth the money for me, as I actually have used it a lot more than what I thought I would.

Have a look at this site for more information - i don't recommend you buy from there, but just found this to show you what it looks like.
http://www.hahnel.ie/index.cfm?page=dslrremotecontrols&id=35&pId=35
And yes you are prejudiced. Though I would only buy L lens now...:o

[Tannin]

Sounds like a plan, Shelly. Thankyou!

[jim]

Tony—some Chinese stuff:

http://www.phottixstore.com/?___store=ps_oc_en

I have a Phottix Cleon, and it works well on my Nikon, both as a wired and wireless remote. Should imagine it goes ok with Canon too.

[edit] That is to say there are Canon versions, and I expect they're good too.

[Analog6]

I have a cheapie and it works very well indeed. Purchsed it on eBay. You can also get programmable ones that you set the length you want and set and forget. For things like star trail pics, you can do a series of images at, say 4mins, and then just go away and do something else.

Here is one eBay seller (http://stores.shop.ebay.com.au/sitedv88_Shutter-Remotes_W0QQ_fsubZ1984618015QQ_sidZ706749745QQ_trksidZp4634Q2ec0Q2em322) who has them for $7.99, but just go to the shutter remotes section and tick Canon and you will get lots of choices.

Manuals can be downloaded on line. I fond having it on the computer much more convenient than trying to find what I want in the book (after I have found the book, of course.

[David]

I have no trouble with my plug in remote for long exposures Tony: and I give it a good clean when I get home and put tape over the other socket openings so no crap can get in.

Eventually you are going to be asking yourself, well how long do I expose for to get the correct exposure. When I started using B it was guess work, you know, think I will try 45 seconds and see how that goes then a minute etc.. in the dark it is very hard to see the results and they look different when you put them on the computer anyway sometimes.

To take the guess work out (this does not always work of course) I keep my ISO at 400 max and leave it there. Then I switch the camera to manual and use infinity to guide my focussing, make sense so far ?

Then I knock the apeture down to the lowest the lens will allow, say 4.0 and adjust the shutter speed to get it where I want it on the 2...1.....0....1....2 for 'correct exposure".

But I want to shoot the shot at F11 because it is a landscape covering some distance...so I do a calculation

At 4.0, the shutter speed on ..0..tells me I need 25 seconds for 'correct exposure'

I want F11 which is 3 stops up from 4.0, so I have to multiply my shutter speed/exposure time by 3 .. so 25sec becomes 50sec....50 sec becomes 100sec and 100sec becomes 200sec. now I know I need to expose the image for 3 min 20 seconds to get (roughly) a correct exposure at F11. Because I have Photomatix I take three shots, one at the estimated correct exposure and another 2 shot, one at -1 and one at +1 in RAW.

When I get them home I have a look and decide if I can choose one of the 3 options without having to blend them together in Photomatix and if not, whack em together and see what happens.

I have to put a footnote here: I have not done long exposure night shots a great deal, but the theory works in terms of taking out the exposure time guess work most of the time.

As for the watch thing, buy a cheap watch with light colours and a small torch you can put in your pocket (I got one from a service station for 10.00) and use that to watch the time on your new elcheapo watch.

That is all: please don't say you knew all this already :D

[farmer_rob]

I think you'll have to learn to count Tony - or start carrying a watch or something like it (GPS? Mine has a stopwatch function.)

It's disappointing that the higher-end cameras have dropped IR remote support - it was an effective solution IMO.

[OzzieTraveller]

G'day Tony

The above respondents have give you lots of advice

Some time ago I posted a startrails pic using a home-made Bulb attachment
Link ---
http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?t=55161

This might do you quite well at no cost :)
Regards, Phil

[Bally]

http://www.kigrasoft.com/ExpAssist/index.html

If you have an iphone, this mob makes a long exposure calculator with a video of how to use it

[MrJorge]

My 400d, when in Bulb mode, displays the current length of time the shutter has been open on the LCD. So I know how longs its been open for.

Normally I put my ISO to, say 800, then expose using Manual mode until the meter says it's ok. Then I put it back to ISO 100 and do the maths to figure out the equivalent shutter speed required. If that makes sense. Then go to Bulb, leave the shutter open for that amount and away you go.

Of course it's pretty difficult to get it right still sometimes where there are really bright spots and dark spots which mean it still isn't exposed properly but it's trial and error after that.

Interestingly I think I was out with David once and his 7D and the newer models don't have the shutter time on the LCD. If I remember correctly. Weird that the 400D has it and not the bigger and better cameras.

[Kym]

FYI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulb_%28photography%29
The bulb comes from an old style rubber air blower that was squeezed to operate the shutter pneumatically.
The shutter stayed open until the bulb was released.

What worries me is I saw one in use (late 60's), on a very old view camera.
I was very young at the time ;) but remember Dad taking me to his friends place who was into photography, I was intrigued by it all.

[Speedway]

I have a wireless remote for my 7D, it plugs in but I brush and blow out the socket after using in a dusty environment. There is one available from here (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Timer-Remote-Canon-50D-40D-1D-5D-7D-TC-80N3-R8B9-/130398541843?cmd=ViewItem&pt=AU_Cameras_Photographic_Accessories&hash=item1e5c5bd813) for under $30.00 and this one has a full timer built in and you can set it to do multiple exposures (Time lapse) as well. I am going to update mine

[Tallstock]

There is software, used by astronomers, called Astro Photography Tool at www.astroplace.net that might be helpful. Currently only for Canon EOS owners.

[arthurking83]

Tony!

Highly recommended is the Phottix wireless remotes easily and plentifully available on ebay for approx $30ish.

While I have to admit that mine 'broke', the breakage is entirely my fault, and will almost certainly not happen to most ordinary(ie read that as... sane) humans.
I used to place the camera with the wireless remote contraption still attached to the camera(D300) and the plug of the D300 sits at the front of the camera, so it;s easy to just slip it into the camera bag and drive off to the next instalment.
But the camera bag places a lot of pressure on the front of the camera to hold it securely(that's how I set the bag up!), so all of the weight of the camera and lens is being forced onto the small remote plug still attached to the camera, the remote receiver box is usually fitted to the hotshoe.
So the right angled remote plug became a little damaged, where the wires were stressed to breaking point. the remote still works but the cable doesn't.
A replacement D300 connector costs a small fortune, and one day when I find one cheap(cheaper than a replacement wireless remote that is!.. I'll fix it, and donate it to a nice person with a Nikon 8pin plug type camera...

Phottix seem to do the job for a good price. I have seen similar wirleless remotes selling in photographic stores for $80 or more!! They're exactly the same design as the Phottix ones, but I've never seen the Phottix brand for sale in shops.. only on ebay.

Highly recommended.

The wired remote has a shutter release locking mechanism, where you press the remote release button and then slide the locking mechanism over or under the button and then count the time away.

The phottix wireless remote works on a very simple and sensible system where you press and hold the button on the remote for about 2seconds and are then able to release your finger off the button(to open the shutter), and then press the remote button again(to close the shutter).
Cameras should have that system by default and via a menu system.. after all they are electronically linked so it should be easy to do.

Also phottix have reasonably cheap intervalometer wired remote that can be used to set a timed exposure. How reliable they are??... I dunno, but I like their products so I'd chance it.

Substitute Phottix for most of the other ebay brands too and I think you'll end up with the same device.

[kiwi]

+1 on the phottix

The other option, is pocket wizards or their chineese clone yongnou triggers that can not onky trigger remote speedlights but also cameras

[Tannin]

^ oh bugger!

Just as I had decided to buy the Photix! I really can't imagine wanting to do anything too fancy by way of remote shutter triggering .... but remote flash .... that just might be another story.

I better go and look at Pocket Wizards, I suppose. If this winds up costimng me another small fortune, Kiwi, it's all your fault!

Seriously now, thanks heaps to all in this thread. It has been a fantastic response and I've learned a lot.

[DAdeGroot]

Thanks Dave.

Ouch!

Not only do I not have a remote - the 10-second timer has always done everything I need - you mean I'm supposed to count seconds aloud or something? I don't wear a watch and in any case the reason I want more than 30 seconds is because it's dark, so how am I supposed to read it!

Well you hit the light button for the LCD on the top, which will show you how long the shutter has been open. Of course, that means touching the camera.



How extraordinarily primitive! Why on earth don't cameras have a way to say "45 seconds"?

Guess I'll just have to get used to it. And I imagine remotes cost a lot - I'll go and find out.

Some Nikons have an in-built intervalometer which will do just that.

However, in the Canon world, what you want is a timer remote. The Canon one is hellishly expensive, but I use a Micnova brand one (cheap chinese knockoff - about $70), and it works a treat.

Yes, you do need to plug it into the remote port on the side of the body, but that port is relatively well sealed from the inside of the camera so dust/moisture shouldn't be a problem.

With batteries in the remote (2xAAA), you can program in the length of exposure and number of exposures to take. Without batteries, it works as a normal corded remote with a locking switch.

The other option if your camera supports IR ((400D-550D), 20D-50D, 5DII), you can use either the $35 Canon RC-5 or a $5 chinese IR remote. With the IR remotes, the first press opens the shutter, the second closes it, but neither have a built in timer so you need to use a watch or phone with a stopwatch to time your exposures (or sing songs of known lengths) ;-)

[Tannin]

I just spammed the thread with thanks to everyone ... I don't usually do that, but I couldn't possibly just thank one of you.

[kiwi]

^ oh bugger!

Just as I had decided to buy the Photix! I really can't imagine wanting to do anything too fancy by way of remote shutter triggering .... but remote flash .... that just might be another story.

I better go and look at Pocket Wizards, I suppose. If this winds up costimng me another small fortune, Kiwi, it's all your fault!

Seriously now, thanks heaps to all in this thread. It has been a fantastic response and I've learned a lot.

Lol, the yongnuo triggers are actually very good, and you get a transmitter and three receivers for < $100 . I have these but haven't yet used to trigger the camera, there's an extra step to do this, but it's possible I understand

[kiwi]

I can't possibly understand either how anyone can possibly fail to count to say 100s in their head very accuratly and why you'd therefore need a timer of any kind

[Tannin]

^ I'd be OK in summer, but in winter I max out at counting to 10. After that I'd have to take my shoes and socks off and it's too cold. ;)

[arthurking83]

once you get past 1 minute exposures, the actual time in between each minute is academic anyhow(in terms of actual exposure).

Time how long it takes to roll a cigarette(25sec with cold numb fingies! :D) or smoke the actual cigarette(2:29.. in the same freezing cold conditions with a now very wet dribbly nose!).

exposure lengths in between those two upper and lower values usually mean only subtle differences in highlight and shadow details.. which you can recover in PP anyhow! :D
More importantly, the omnipresent nature of the resulting cigarette smoke wafting gently in front of the lens usually acts as a pseudo GND filter with funky effects.



:lol2:

[old dog]

pardon my ignorance chaps but I have the ml-l3 remote and the only problem would be that if I was required to be behind the camera, it would not work. True......solution?

[arthurking83]

solution is to attach something reflective(even partially reflective) to the camera so that you can bounce the IR beam back at the IR sensor on the camera.

easy solution. get a piece of aluminium foil and fold it so that it can sit somewhere both out of the also in line with the IR sensor. I made up a large piece and shaped it to curve around the lens and stick up in a flag like manner so that it shielded the IR sensor from the front of the camera. I used a rubber band around the curved part of the foil and secured it to the lens. IR beam used to work from a distance of at least 2-3meters behind the camera.
(I used to have photos of a very old(hence small) CPU heatsink that I also once used. I tried to polish the aluminium flat surface but it wasn't as good as the shiny side of household foil. The heat sink being what it is, had perfectly formed fins where the rubberband would easily hold it against the lens.. even tho it wasn't curved correctly.
(Needless to say that those images, being fun images, have been deleted)

you know what they say: Where there's a willingness, there's a waywardness :D

[maccaroneski]

Arthur you should really change your username from "Arthurking" to ArthurMcGyver" :)

[arthurking83]

:lol2:

Oi! :D

Y'know!?.. if I search hard enough, I suddenly realise that I'm sillier than I originally thought I was.

Of course I have the images still saved on my PC. They weren't captured with a DSLSR, but with (camera)phone . ie. saved to a different directory ;)

53533

53534

53535

53536

the heat sink came off a 386(I think) PC CPU. The foil was just pressed onto the heatsink back.
On a zoom lens.. pick your focal length carefully! :p

Also.. did you know that almost all multifunction remotes can probably operate your cameras shutter remotely(if the camera is wireless IR capable).
I purchased a cheapo($5) replacement remote(for a TV), and just pressed every button until I heard the shutter operate. On that remote, it turned out that the Vol Up button does the trick! :D

[Tannin]

^ Very poor quality kit there. Oh, the camera's allright, but those cheap and nasty PC Chips motherboards are nothing but trouble.

[arthurking83]

:lol:

ROFL: ya'know!?.. lucky for me that the BIOS fried itself, and a replacement chip was too much trouble to get, install, etc..
Started my quest on building my own systems from that point onwards.

[Tannin]

I'm serious Arthur! http://www.redhill.net.au/b/b-bad.html - same scumbags, older scam.

[old dog]

thanks Arthur. I`ll destroy my computer to get one of those chips....:). Then I`ll be able to fire backwards..:D

[old dog]

thanks Arthur. I`ll make one of these. I`ll have to destroy this computer to get the necessary parts.:D.....double post...gremlins again.....:eek:

[Boo53]

FYI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulb_%28photography%29
The bulb comes from an old style rubber air blower that was squeezed to operate the shutter pneumatically.
The shutter stayed open until the bulb was released.

.

I've wondered where the term came from, makes sense now