Nikon International Warranty - VCAT ruling includes Australia

[webchik]

I came across an interesting and recent post in dpreview where someone appears to have challenged Nikon on their International Warranty in Australia - and won. I thought some of you may be interested in this.


"...If you buy a Nikon lens it comes with an international warranty which applies everywhere INCLUDING AUSTRALIA. Nikon have an amendment to the warranty posted on their web site [http://ww2.nikon.com.au/warranty.php] which says you must purchase through an Australian Nikon dealer for the International warranty to be valid. A friend has recently tested this with VCAT who upheld his claim against Nikon Australia and affirmed Nikon international lens warranties must be honored by Nikon Australia.

Clearly, Nikon has tried to change things to suit themselves and avoid servicing legitimate Nikon products - that just happened to be bought overseas and which carry an Nikon Corporation international warranty. So, it appears with lenses you are safe..."

I would be interested to see if this also applies to a Nikon camera body, and not just a lens - does anyone have any more info on this?

[ricktas]

Ummm, with all due respect, Lenses have always had international warranties. Only the camera bodies have a warranty that is only valid in country of purchase.

[mongo]

It seems to Mongo that no Tribunal, including VCAT, would have entertained the application and determined it unless their was a real issue to be determined. Therefore, Mongo must assume there was a issue where the applicant believed he or she had an international warranty on the lens but for some reason Nikon Australia was refusing to honour it – presumably on the basis of the wording in their warranty documents (which I have not seen).

If the wording and circumstances of the lens warranty is the same or similar to that which is on the Nikon bodies, the principles which came out of the VCAT judgement may well apply or at least, be argued in any challenge to the body warranties for bodies purchased outside Australia.

Mongo would certainly strongly consider challenging them in a Consumer Tribunal if it adversely affecting his interests and after looking at the terms of the judgement and the wording of the warranty.

[I @ M]

I see nothing on the Nikon Aus. website warranty page that is any different from that which has been there for quite some time stating that an international warranty applies to 'Conventional equipment (Lenses, Film SLR's compact film cameras & Speedlights)' which has been purchased from a legitimate Nikon dealer.

The question on the warranty on DSLR bodies has been asked, answered and tested in the past.
The reasons are quite well outlined on their policy on grey imports page (http://www.nikon.com.au/pagearticle.php?pageid=65-52b9b66212), the main reasons are that imported bodies may not have the correct charger and / or power cord which may lead to damage of the camera electronics.
The other area is that the owners manual may not be in English which could lead to camera failure due to the operator/owner failing to read the warnings and not taking the precautions outlined in the manual to prevent such damage. ( It is assumed that all Australian residents are able to read English )

Finally, webchik, all VCAT rulings are made public, can you please provide a link or reference number for the particular ruling that you allude to -----------

[maccaroneski]

Or at least some names... it would be here: http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/vic/VCAT/ but a quick name search on "Nikon" brings up nothing.

[etherial]

The info from the OP came from DPReview. A quick search finds where it was sourced from, but no links to VCAT or sources etc..

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1021&message=33682483&changemode=1
The post is right at the bottom of this page. I took a very quick look at the thread, there isn't much in it.

[rellik666]

Ok sorry I am being really stupid, but I am little reluctant as I am going to put $2K + down....

I want a 70-200mm VRii and I am looking at getting it from B&H with an international warranty.

As I would be saving $500+ even after shipping and GST, is it worth it? But mainly the international warranty would be honered here?

Roo

[ricktas]

Lenses are covered under international warranties, so if there is a manufacturing fault with your lens, you can send it to Nikon Aus for repair.

[Wayne]

As Rick said, just retain the receipt from B&H for proof of purchase, and register i with Nikon if required. They will bail out of a warranty claim if you fail to meet your obligations should such registration be required.

[Boo53]

" A friend has recently tested this with VCAT who upheld his claim against Nikon Australia and affirmed Nikon international lens warranties must be honored by Nikon Australia. [/B]"



The reference to "a friend" in the dpreview immediately made me think it wasn't as it was presented

[rellik666]

Just read this on the Nikon USA (http://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/9677/related/1/session/L2F2LzEvc2lkL3RUUzNkQ2Fr/kw/lens%20warranty/p/81/c/339/r_id/116678) site, seems a lot more specific than the Aus one.



Is the Nikon USA warranty valid outside the United States?

The Nikon USA warranty on film cameras, lenses, and speedlights will be honored by Nikon-authorized service centers outside the United States as long as you have the yellow copy of the Nikon USA warranty and your sales receipt from a dealer in the USA. The key to the validity of the warranty is a sales receipt from the country in which you purchased the equipment. If you purchase equipment in another country where the Nikon Worldwide Warranty applies, copies of the sales receipt and this warranty are necessary to obtain warranty service in the USA. Buying the equipment with a Nikon Worldwide Warranty in the United States is not recommended because that warranty is not valid in the USA without a sales receipt from an overseas dealer, and it is not valid outside the USA with a sales receipt from a dealer in the USA.

Please note that the Nikon USA warranty we supply with our sport optics products (binoculars, fieldscopes, spotting scopes, etc.) is valid only in the USA. The same is true of the Nikon Digital Imaging Limited Warranty we supply with digital cameras and film scanners.

Roo

[swifty]

My understanding from talking to Nikon Aust service is that:
yes, although Nikon lenses and speedlights have international warranty, the original product must be purchased in the country it was officially imported into.
So it means Internet buying from BH of a US or "international" model does not qualify. U need to be in the states buying a USA model, then the warranty will be honoured in Aust afterwards.
For all gray imports it doesn't mean they won't repair it tho, just not under warranty and with a charge.
It's already better than Nikon usa's policy who won't even repair it even with a charge if it was bought gray.

[Kym]

the original product must be purchased in the country it was officially imported into.

That's the key phrase and subject to legal interpretation.

Scenario 1
1. B&H import as a valid USA Nikon retailer (or via the Nikon USA authorised importer)
2. You are in Noo Yawk and physically buy a lens from B&H
3. You return to Oz
4. It develops a fault
5. You get it serviced under international warranty via Nikon Australia
All good!

Scenario 2 (hmmmm)
1. B&H import as a valid USA Nikon retailer (or via the Nikon USA authorised importer)
2. You are in Sydney buy a lens from B&H over the net
3. It gets posted and arrives in good condition, with receipts etc
4. It develops a fault
5. You get it serviced under international warranty via Nikon Australia ???
Maybe they won't do this?

:confused013 :umm:

[rellik666]

I'm sorry but the way I read it is I buy a lens from B&H and I get a reciept from B&H in the USA then the warranty is valid internationally. It doesn't matter where it was posted to after I bought it.

Surely if I buy the lens on the net in the US it is no different...get over this physically buying it in the store...

Roo

[Kym]

I'm sorry but the way I read it is I buy a lens from B&H and I get a receipt from B&H in the USA then the warranty is valid internationally. It doesn't matter where it was posted to after I bought it.
Surely if I buy the lens on the net in the US it is no different...get over this physically buying it in the store...

IANAL...
You would think so, but lawyers may have a different view.
All I was demonstrating by the two scenarios is that it can be open to interpretation.

Clearly buying from B&H is different to some random eBay shop.

[swifty]

Precisely what Kym said.
The info I've been given verbally is that in Kym's scenario 1 it's A-Ok but scenario 2 won't be honoured under warranty. I have no background in law so I have no idea how legal that is but AFAIK, that's the policy.

[swifty]

The only way to get around it as far as I can see is if u have a friend in the US and buys it for u there. Then ask him/her to ship it to u. Small distinction I know but possibly a big difference should something go wrong with ur lens.

[agb]

I think that the critical bit is that it (then lens) must be purchased from an authorised Nikon dealer.
From the Nikon website.

All warranty repairs or adjustments must be made by a Nikon Service Facility.

· A claim under this warranty may only be made:

(a) if the equipment was purchased from an authorised Nikon dealer,

(b) upon presentation of the completed Nikon Worldwide Service Warranty Card (Copy 'C' , customer's portion), and

(c) upon presentation of proof of purchase. Proof of purchase may include the purchase receipt or any other evidence of purchase.

[Speedway]

To me the whole thing stinks :angry0:. They made it, they should cover the warranty no matter where in the world you purchased it or it breaks down. The whole thing is about getting out of honouring their tissue paper warranties and saving money.:action:
Keith.

[swifty]

Yep..this whole convoluted policy sure does stink. But what I think's worse and at the root of the problem is the massive disparity between aust import prices and overseas prices. Yea they can blame it on additional freight costs, australia's isolation, taxes yadayadayada but it's still cheaper to buy at retail price overseas, pay for shipping of an individual item, pay the GST and still come out cheaper than Aust and they wonder why they have a gray import problem. Of course not on all products but there's enough out there for a thriving gray market.

[Speedway]

The whole thing is that these multi national company's know they can fight the average purchaser into bankruptcy long before the courts get close to a decision on the legality of their actions. That's how the banks got away with their fees for nothing for so long. I'll be watching that one closely.
Keith.

[rellik666]

Yep..this whole convoluted policy sure does stink. But what I think's worse and at the root of the problem is the massive disparity between aust import prices and overseas prices. Yea they can blame it on additional freight costs, australia's isolation, taxes yadayadayada but it's still cheaper to buy at retail price overseas, pay for shipping of an individual item, pay the GST and still come out cheaper than Aust and they wonder why they have a gray import problem. Of course not on all products but there's enough out there for a thriving gray market.

The thing is these retailers overseas are still making a profit too!

Thing is the whole thing is so complex that it gets to the point where you give up long before you even claim on the warranty! :Doh:

Roo

[mongo]

Still, no one has produced a precise reference to the VCAT decision or a copy of it so Mongo can study it. Additionally, it has been mentioned earlier above, that Nikon may have made changes to its warranty documents. This may have been done in response to any court ruling to attempt to overcome any wording that the Tribunal may have found contributed to Nikon being found liable. So, the decision , if it exists, may no longer be relevant or effective.

There is just too much speculation and not enough facts to go on in this thread. Mongo agrees there should not be so much uncertainty and complication about a simple product. Mongo cannot think of any other common goods that have so much nonsense surrounding them as far as warranty goes. So, why should it be so with photographic equipment ? It does stink .

[rellik666]

Sorry Mongo, only really added to this instead of starting a new thread as it is sort of relevant, but yes...no proof of anything to do with VCAT!

Roo

[swifty]

Same here. Oops.. Sorry for taking things off course. Apologies.

[Kym]

Yep..this whole convoluted policy sure does stink. But what I think's worse and at the root of the problem is the massive disparity between aust import prices and overseas prices.<snip>

Given the C R Kennedy will price match Sigma on 'legit' grey prices it does make you wonder.

[knumbnutz]

Hi Kym,
How do you mean exactly, could you give me an example.
I am looking at buying a sigma lens right now, here it is $3200, OS=$2300 inc tax & freight.
I find it appaulling the price disparity and if it was ~10% per say, no one would bother buying OS at all.

I also thought that if you bought anything OS, you would need to send it back OS for warranty.
But what if i travel to HK or USA and bought stuff, how do they know it is imported or bought on OS holiday...

Too many grey areas that seem like bully play without real worth.
They just need to fix the price up and we wouldnt have the problem to start with.

Cheers Neil

[I @ M]

But what if i travel to HK or USA and bought stuff, how do they know it is imported or bought on OS holiday...



Simple, the warranty providers are the importers and the very first thing they do is check the serial number of the item against their database of items that they have received in Aus. and distributed to their dealers.

That is most definitely the case with Sigma as I asked them to check a couple of lenses that I had in for repair, it took them all of 2 minutes to confirm where each one was sold.

[knumbnutz]

Not quite what i was meaning.
I know they can check what is their stock, through serial no. but they have said, that if you travel OS and bought the lens then they would honor the warranty.
They also say that if you bought it, say by ebay from the same place they wont warranty it.
So how do they know the difference in this case ?

Cheers Neil



Simple, the warranty providers are the importers and the very first thing they do is check the serial number of the item against their database of items that they have received in Aus. and distributed to their dealers.

That is most definitely the case with Sigma as I asked them to check a couple of lenses that I had in for repair, it took them all of 2 minutes to confirm where each one was sold.

[Speedway]

I'd like to know that too Neil.
Keith.

[I @ M]

Sorry Neil, maybe I am confused, Kym was talking specifically about Sigma lenses and you asked for clarification which I presumed was about Sigma lenses.

As far as I know and have been told, Sigma lenses DO NOT come with an international warranty, if you buy from OS it doesn't have a warranty in Aus.
If CR Kennedy have told you different they musty have changed their policy recently.

The original topic of this thread, Nikon lens international warranty is simply being rehashed.

[I @ M]

From CR Kennedy's web pages on warranty ---

C.R. Kennedy & Co P/L will only undertake warranty repairs on products sourced through us. All products imported directly from overseas and resold are not covered by our warranty. This includes purchases through eBay or through grey importers such as www.camerasdirect.com.au, www.d-d-photographics.com.au, www.DealsDirect.com.au, www.globalmediapro.com and www.photobuff.com.au.

In full at http://www.crkennedy.com.au/v1/index.cfm?pageID=465&pageRef=179&

and

2 YEAR OFFICIAL SIGMA WARRANTY
C.R.Kennedy & Company offers a two year warranty on Sigma lenses and
flashes.
This warranty is only valid on Australian stock purchased through an
Authorised Dealer.

from http://www.crkennedy.com.au/v1/index.cfm?pageID=315&pageRef=210&

[Art Vandelay]

Mongo cannot think of any other common goods that have so much nonsense surrounding them as far as warranty goes. So, why should it be so with photographic equipment ? It does stink .

Mongo is not alone. ;)

It's not just photographic equip, it's the same story across many industries.

Am heavily invloved in fishing/boating & selectively purchase o/s or here depending on the outcome of a complex mathematical formula that has the following components. Potential savings/warranty issues /potential cost of repair/life of equipment/relationship with current local provider/and all round gut feeling.

Having recently imported a whole boat and some accesories from the US, I explored it heaps, and even spoke direct to several engine companies where I couldn't get clarification from a dealer or their web site. Nearly all companies won't warrant the same engine imported direct vs purchased here, same situation as camera bodies.

The only manufacturer (mercury) that even entertains it has stupid limits. ie you get 12 months warranty if purchased o/s, or 5 years if purchased here. Yamaha, Suzuki, Evinrude etc dont cover it at all.

Marine electronics (depth sounders /gps/ radars) are the same. Lowrance/Navman/Furuno all have a no warranty policy except if it's come through the official distributer.

Fishing gear's the same. Reels and rods of all brands have a no warranty policy like above.

This global trade has opened doors that most distributors didn't want opened.

[Kym]

Yes, Sigma lenses must be bought via an authorised dealer, but they do price match grey importers.
http://www.crkennedy.com.au/v1/index.cfm?pageID=465


We will attempt to match, through our authorised Sigma dealer network, any legitimate advertised internet price on Sigma lenses by these grey importers.ﾠThese prices do not include traditional pre-sales and after sales service normally given by your local retail store. We suggest that you research the product thoroughly before making any purchase.

The point is that if they can price match and offer warranty then why not other brands?

[phild]

To me the whole thing stinks :angry0:. They made it, they should cover the warranty no matter where in the world you purchased it or it breaks down. The whole thing is about getting out of honouring their tissue paper warranties and saving money.:action:
Keith.
You're right on the money, this denial of warranty thing is anti-competative practice, if Nikon (and Canon for that matter) only want to sell via "authorised dealers" then why do they let others in on the action in the first place.

[tcdev]

if Nikon (and Canon for that matter) only want to sell via "authorised dealers" then why do they let others in on the action in the first place.
Because a sale is a sale is a sale. Market share is what counts. I can assure you their global strategy takes into consideration grey market sales just as video game consoles' domination also depend on piracy as much as it does legitimate sales of games.

I can sort-of understand why they don't honour grey market warranties (they have no control over the product between the factory and the consumer) but it is also definitely a money-saving strategy. When you're lumped with a faulty grey-market $2K Nikon camera, it's a pretty sure bet you'll cough up the money to get it fixed. I only wonder though, whether your next camera is going to be another grey market Nikon, authorised Nikon... or a Canon???

The whole region issue is getting a bit ridiculous in this day-and-age though. I've read of people buying PC video games in their country of residence, then subsequently moving overseas and no longer being able to play the games they've paid for. It's a global economy, travel is much more affordable, and these sorts of issues are only going to compound. Too bad legislation takes years - or even decades - to catch up.