Photography editing: Do a course or teach yourself ?

[David]

If you were starting out with photoshop or lightroom or one of the other software programs right now because after a year or so of avoiding doing much in the way of image post processing you decided you need to catch up with the 21st Century, get with the program, and learn how to 'edit' your images, how would you do it ?

Would you,

A. Sign up for one of those Photoshop for Dummies courses that can cost some serious money,

B. Find a course online and go for 'self paced learning',

C. Just buy the program and muddle your way through it over time or

D. Other and what would your 'other' be ?

The reason I am asking is because some people on AP new to photography like me want to learn how to do post processing but will struggle with shelling out alot of money for the software (Photoshop, Lightroom etc), then balk at having to shell out a heap more money to pay some professional in a TAFE course or Online course that can cost as much.

People who have been doing post shoot editing on various programs might have an opinion on what they would do if they were starting out right now- we newbies with no clue might learn from your experiences.

[Analog6]

I have signed up for the Landscape masterclass on Better Photography magazine's website. It is terrific and teaches you all about adjustment layers, masks etc, and I have only looked at the first two tutorials. There is a good free one on Adobe Camera Raw so you can see what you get. I've also bought the Focal Press book on CS4 as a reference and extra teaching aid.

[arthurking83]

C.

it's not that hard to:

E. find lots of info free around the net

F. ask other members whatthey did to achieve a particular result(if they use a program that you decided on

G. find an (free)actions for PS, or a set of batch files for any other program to help you along as well.

H. I think if the software needs too much time to learn, then it;s the wrong software(especially to begin with)
Of course there's going to be a learning curve with any software, and I found as I fumbled my way through both PS and Nikon Capture.... way back when.... I fumbled more with PS, and got results with Nikon Capture.

ie. Nikon Capture4.x(not CaptureNX.. the older version before the current one) seemed more intuitive, and the results were more instantaneous.
There are other software that may be able to help as well, just to get a grip of the ideas of what to do with the processing of your images.

Other programs of note to consider...

Bibble5(currently in beta, but due any time soon??)
CaptureOne
Even a simple viewer program like FSViewer can 'process' images a little. very basic, but what'd you expect for free.

Maybe a book on how to use PS is the better way to go.

I remember a few references to a particular chap that has a good guide to Photoshop.

Beauty of using a book, is that it's there in front of you, not taking up PC time and space, as you edit :th3:

:confused:

[ving]

learned all by myself :D

[Speedway]

I purchased Photoshop Elements5 a few years ago using the book that came with it and the suck it and see approach and lots of help from members of sites like AP and P4P I am putting the s/ware to good use, still a lot to learn though, I have also been getting the English magazine "Digital Photo" for a few months now and it comes with a CD with some very good tutorials (4-6 per issue) on it for both PS and Elements. At the moment I am looking at upgrading to elements 8 which was released recently.
Keith.

[dbax]

I did a short photoshop course at a loal community college, it helped, but I think the main learning I've done is hands on, magazines, web tutorials, I've got a couple of book I refer to every know and then. Ask plenty of questions on forums. Once you become familiar with the tools and there uses your away.
I reckon if you can find an APer nearby, that can spend an hour or two with you, thats the is the way to go:D:D

[Kym]

Self taught (and still learning)
I have some books, ebooks, and use the 'net esp. youtube for examples/tutes
So far there is nothing I've not been able to figure out from AP and the resources above
The main things is there are many ways to skin a cat! So there are alternate ways to PP an image
I have got my basic standard workflow sorted

[phild]

I'm in the self taught category as well, although my PS & Lightroom skills are pretty ordinary.

I've just bought Scott Kelby's books on CS4 & Lightroom to improve my skills.

[mithrandir]

I would suggest a course for Photoshop. Lightroom is more intuitive and can be learned well with a few visits to Lightroom users groups.

[Kym]

I would suggest a course for Photoshop. Lightroom is more intuitive and can be learned well with a few visits to Lightroom users groups.

Courses are iffy. Either they are at the wrong level or are not good quality.
I find to get one for what you need and have a quality teacher is difficult.
The youtube tutes are very good

[mcdesign]

I can recommend this book by Scott Kelby http://www.bookware.com.au/cgi-bin/bookware/9780321580092
It will take you through Photoshop in easy steps very concisely, each lesson builds on the previous. Warning!!!!! you will never get to the bottom of Photoshop I have been using it for years and am still learning. Better Photography Magazine's site has tutorials that you can download by Peter Eastway that are excellent http://www.betterphotography.com/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&page=shop.browse&category_id=2&Itemid=8&vmcchk=1&Itemid=8
I have the CD and was amazed what he gets out of a pretty drab file just by using layers and curves. Good luck!

PS. Also the Better Photoshop Techniques Magazine is excellent too.

[ricktas]

Here is option I, seeing AK added a heap more to the list.

Organise an AP processing meet. Everyone takes their laptops etc and you go to someones house and spend an afternoon teaching each other.

I am self taught (books and videos), but I also learnt a lot from other photographers, by catching up with them and talking about processing methods etc.

[etherial]

Here is option I, seeing AK added a heap more to the list.

Organise an AP processing meet. Everyone takes their laptops etc and you go to someones house and spend an afternoon teaching each other.


Snap! I was wondering about the same thing. mmmm

[Avalon]

I'm in the same boat David. :)
I find Picasa 3.5 (free download from Google) does most of the basics I want and is very easy to learn.
However, I would like to go a bit further with CS3 but have found it a bit overwhelming by myself.

I recently signed up for a short TAFE Brisbane course which I hoped would help,
but they cancelled it at the last moment and didn't bother to let me know.
I guess I wouldn't recommend TAFE. :(

[David]

Thanks everyone for sharing your ideas and experiences.

Looks like Im going to have to buy Kelby's book, go and visit You Tube, pay attention to the tutorials that come with the photography magazine Im suscribed to, sign up for an online course for the basic stuff, bother Odille and Kane etc for more impromtu tutorials and takes Ricks advise and organise a photoshop meetup sometime soon - that should do it - now I remember why Ive been avoiding this project for so long:) - Oh well, you only walk this way once.

[dbax]

David I have CS3 if your ever down Tweed way give me a yell. happy to run through the basics with you:D
PS you as well Avalon

[Lani]

Just don't expect too much too soon, as with other aspects of Photography, it is a never ending and fun, if sometimes frustrating, journey. Just do bits and pieces, and enjoy the ride. Depends on your learning style too, i learn better if i can watch someone do it, then refer to text later....so you tube is good as are meets. Kelby's books are a good starting point though.

[J.davis]

We had a bloke (that has just moved out here from England) come and gave us a lecture at our Club Night- he was very good and has DVD's for sale that are like YouTube Tutorials. I bought two of his DVD's and have learnt heaps. His address is WWW.beckhamdigital.co.uk and he resides on the north side of Brisbane.
As well as that, I sugest that you bite the bullit and by CS3 (old but more than enough) and a copy of 'CS3 for dummies' from the library. Sit down with a glass of red and a picture and see what happens.
I suggest thet you go through the 'adjustments mode' of the picture and move the controles a fair bit to see what they do - in reality they only need to be used sparingly.
Do this for a few nights and soon you will get the hang of it - there is a thousand things in CS3 that you will never use and others that are used in all PP.
Enjoy your journey:th3:

[Prang]

Check out your local TAFE collage they quite often do Photoshop Courses over a couple of week nights.

Just on Pisca and RAW files, with the Penatx the colours are totally off I am not sure if it is the same with other brands RAW.

[Avalon]

Thanks for that link J.davis.
Just had a look at the site, and it looks like it could be very useful indeed. :)

[Seesee]

Mostly self taught via trial and error error error error...error.

But also one of the best learning sources is the Digital Camera Magazine, the English version available every month from most newsagents. Apart from inspiring images to get your creative juices flowing every edition comes with an instructional CD covering all aspects of most PS programs all in easy to comprehend step by step instructions, as well as step by step instructions in print as well. Features more advanced instruction and simple to at least get you over initial hurdles.

A whole lot cheaper than paying someone to educate you, and a keepable reference library of CD's to refer back to at any time.

[Avalon]

David I have CS3 if your ever down Tweed way give me a yell. happy to run through the basics with you:D
PS you as well Avalon
Thanks for the kind offer dbax,:)
you might live to regret it though ;)

[David]

Mostly self taught via trial and error error error error...error.

But also one of the best learning sources is the Digital Camera Magazine, the English version available every month from most newsagents. Apart from inspiring images to get your creative juices flowing every edition comes with an instructional CD covering all aspects of most PS programs all in easy to comprehend step by step instructions, as well as step by step instructions in print as well. Features more advanced instruction and simple to at least get you over initial hurdles.

A whole lot cheaper than paying someone to educate you, and a keepable reference library of CD's to refer back to at any time.

Thanks SeeSee: I will go look up the mag at my local newsagent this week and give it a go..if it saves me some money being taught by a so called at a course it will be a very welcome source

[Outoflipsync]

I can recommend some of the free video podcasts you can download through itunes. You don't need to have a video ipod, as you can download and watch them from itunes on your PC. A couple that I subscribe to and can highly recommend are....

Photoshop for Digital Photographers (website has videos as well http://www.thedigitalphotographyconnection.com/ )
Photography 101

These are very easy to watch, listen too and understand..

Enjoy

[Miaow]

Taught myself and look around the net or ask on things not sure on - Don't think I'd pay for a course on something unless really needed etc

[Colourised]

i myself am self taught. and i think its not THAT hard to begin with. the only hard part to begin with is knowing what you want to do in the first place imo. after that its just time consuming! if u knw where everything is what everything does (buttons, functions, symbols etc) then its pretty much gng to flow your way.

but dont take my word for it. i only do minor pp on my photos anyway.

if youre interested in portraiture post-processing i think this might be a really good ebook. ive yet to get it myself but eventually i will!

http://banhup.com/wordpress2/products-page/ebook-for-beginners/

[Mick]

Its a big C for me. I love it. There's just so much to learn it never gets dull.

[daletron]

yea i found that just spending time in photoshop helped me alot. it also helps to do a couple tutorials from the net, they get you through the basics. Once you figure out what does what, you can pretty much just teach yourself.
Also experimenting is great.

[David]

yea i found that just spending time in photoshop helped me alot. it also helps to do a couple tutorials from the net, they get you through the basics. Once you figure out what does what, you can pretty much just teach yourself.
Also experimenting is great.

After originally posting this thread, I realise there is no easy fast way; you pick up tricks from expereinced people, download a crash course or two, but mostly its experimentation and putting the time in to learn the skills just like you do with the camera..damn. :)

[Darvidanoar]

...
The youtube tutes are very good

I watched a bunch of them and started to wonder how can you tell the good from the bad? So many of them seemed to start with "Ok, so the first thing I'm going to do is sharpen my image ..." :confused013
:p

[Darvidanoar]

Here is option I, seeing AK added a heap more to the list.

Organise an AP processing meet. Everyone takes their laptops etc and you go to someones house and spend an afternoon teaching each other.

I am self taught (books and videos), but I also learnt a lot from other photographers, by catching up with them and talking about processing methods etc.

Ooh, yes! I would love to sit down with some of the folk on this forum and watch how they approach PP on their images.

[DAdeGroot]

After originally posting this thread, I realise there is no easy fast way; you pick up tricks from expereinced people, download a crash course or two, but mostly its experimentation and putting the time in to learn the skills just like you do with the camera..damn. :)

Yep that's exactly it.

I self taught, and pretty much did the same thing. Sometimes I knew what I wanted to achieve, but not how to do it, and that's where photoshop shines as there are so many tutorial videos on the 'net that it's almost impossible to not learn how to do what you want ;-)

Then it's just practice, practice, practice until you perfect that technique.

[DAdeGroot]

Ooh, yes! I would love to sit down with some of the folk on this forum and watch how they approach PP on their images.

Well if you're ever in my general area and want to drop by, just let me know :)

[Darvidanoar]

Careful dave, I might just take you up on that :)

[nigo75]

Magazines & Youtube

[Dylan & Marianne]

Tons and tons of ways to do it David.
My wife and I are both self taught and every so often we keep gathering more ways to do things.
Much of the basis for what I learned was through a site called www.photoshopessentials.com and the tutorials there.
It's one thing to look at all of these things, but until you do each process with hundreds of photos, it's something thats still not intuitive until its a reflex.
When I'm trying to learn something new, I apply the technique on to every photo I process so that it becomes engrained - (then delete the layer if its something that doesn't suit).

[Brodie]

Become a NAPP member. best $100 odd bucks you will spend. Google it.

Subscribe to the Photoshop User TV Podcast. Brilliant tips every week.

[JazzXP]

Become a NAPP member. best $100 odd bucks you will spend. Google it.

Subscribe to the Photoshop User TV Podcast. Brilliant tips every week.

You don't need a membership to subscribe, but yeah, I'm considering a NAPP membership myself (I'm self taught, but I've been using Photoshop for quite a number of years now).

[Ruthie72]

www.photoradar.com is a great site with tutorials on using elements and photoshop ... excellent site !!

[Chilli]

Thanks for all the above links and info..much appreciated.
But digital dummy here :o has one question,
Where/how does Lightroom fit in with Photoshop....?

[RLeadbetter]

i found when starting out www.pixel2life.com (http://www.pixel2life.com) to be one of the most helpful sites going. It is a regularly update catologue of tutorials for all sorts.

Good luck

[kazdez]

Partly self taught, but still do not understand what I am doing sometimes. Can do the very basics, and have a son who is great at it, but I decided that I wanted something a bit more structured. So am starting an 7 week night course next week.

Husband says I probably know enough of what they are going to teach, but it might help me put it all in proper perspective.
They also offer a PS for photographers, but it is on a Saturday and I work on Saturdays.

[aycee]

To learn the art of manipulation requires endless hours of practice but first I think you have to know how to master it enough to use it.....books are a very cheap and very good way to do it..The Photoshop Bible Dummies etc are all good though far far too comprehensive for most...there are books galore..Scott Kelby is one very good one,,see Margaret's link though he is a Mac man and doest handle the short cuts available in Windows very well..but a wonderful book all the same...but practice on the really hard photos will bring you up to speed and it depends on how much you want to get from it and how much work you are willing to put into it...

the net has wonderful tutorials as well...but in the end its passion and practice

Alan!

[etherial]

Where/how does Lightroom fit in with Photoshop....?

Lightroom is more of a library management, tagging, rating etc and it does basic editing. I was going to say basic editing but I shouldn't because it does more than that. It is really quite powerful and many people have it and nothing else. I use it and do maybe 90% of my work in it. It is great to handling multiple images, and people often have catalogues totalling many thousands.

Photoshop CS/Elements etc are more about working with a small number of images (often only one) and doing detailed editing and they have an extensive amount of tools and brushes etc. They also do layers to give you more flexibility when editing.

As I said, I use Lightroom for cataloguing my photos, and doing cropping and overall image adjustments. Then if you need to do something more, like remove a person, blur a backround etc etc then move to something like Photoshop. I use Photoshop Elements 7 and have found it to do just about all I want it to.

Hope that helps! ;)

[Chilli]

Thanks Mic, yes it helped.

[bigdazzler]

Chilli if your photography requires you to batch process large numbers of images LR is without peer. It is primarily what we call DAM (Digital Asset Management) software that is used for organising and cataloging your images. It is much more than that though. It is a RAW processor as well as a very handy editor. But probably the best thing of all is that Lightroom is a non-destructive editing program. Any change you make to a file is stored in a database, you never alter your original file (unless you specifically tell LR to) and all changes you make to your original can be undone at any time. 90% of my editing is done in LR and I only go over to Photoshop, which is a dedicated photo editor, for more precise and complex editing. IMO every semi-serious photographer should be using LR, it is fantastic.

[paullivo]

I read lots of photo mags, online articles, buy books, subscribe to Kelby Training, search the web for particular techniques I want to use, belong to a couple of camera clubs that have activity night to discuss various aspects of photography and processing and one of the clubs has a SIG (special interest group) specifically on PS. The SIG has less than 10 members and we decide on topics and program them to be discussed at the monthly get together. If no one knows about the particular topic of interest one of us volunteers to take it on and then spends a month or two researching it in depth and then presenting it to the rest of the group by actually doing the techniques at the meeting and providing handouts.

[SnowA]

In the self-taught group (that's not quite right, since I'm a long way from considering myself as having 'learned') but you know what I mean.

Doesn't need to be expensive either - Gimp is free and powerful, and there are plenty of online resources about how to use it. I've also just bought a book to get a better understanding of it, for ease of reference.

[matilda]

i used tutorials from lynda.com

zeke the guy that teaches there, aslo wrote many of the photoshop books out there, and he is a hoot! Makes learning fun.

I also google things I don't know.