These "Tricks" for remote camera triggering vs flash

[Mr Felix]

Folks,

I am once again curious about these things which can remote trigger a camera and/or flash.

I've read that sometimes it is a flash trigger rather than shutter speed. Fair enough.

But I am confused in how it all fits together. If using a "flash" you have the camera in BULB mode and use the pulse of light to act kind of as the shutter.

I get the principle but not exactly the exact application. Sure, these days it is "easier" as it isn't wasting film, and you can see it then and there. So there is no problem on "wasted materials".

I would like to put some time towards doing some tests/experiments but I think it would be nicer if it could be done with others.

[ameerat42]

Mr Felix. I don't know what you mean. To me, a flash trigger is a device that fires the flash
(remotely). Can you provide a link to your readings? Ta.

[Mr Felix]

Well, as an example:

https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/droplet-photography/

[ameerat42]

OK, ta. Will have a look. I fixed your link, BTW. You don't need the
HTML tags.

[Warbler]

There are stacks of "Hot To" videos on Youtube for this Stuff Felix. Let your fingers do the searching.

Here's a good start. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nBZyHOT9rk&ab_channel=FirstManPhotography

[ricktas]

they do 'trigger' using various methods.

Lightning triggers detect the first hint of lightning and trigger the shutter
Infra red and radio wave based triggers, like Pocket Wizard, that are often used in location shoots for fashion portraiture.
Corded triggers that use the pin port on the camera and the user pushes a button on the 'remote'
Then there are triggers that detect if something passes through a beam (similar to those buzzers in business that trigger when someone walks through the front door). These camera triggers are often used to photograph elusive animals, where the sensor is setup on an animal trail with the camera hidden nearby, and when an animal passes in front of the trigger, it makes the shutter fire.
Then you have studio triggers that can either work on detecting a flash firing, or radio waves to trigger a series of studio lights to fire.

How each of these work varies depending on the device. but basically they all send a message to the camera to take a photo, which if set, also fires the flash. What you may need for your photography depends on what you are photographing..as detailed above.

[Mr Felix]

Yeah, well I am interested in them, how they work and maybe making one of them.

As much as my "fingers can do the searching" the part of most ........ importance (?) is the INTERACTION with others.

Seems nowadays people are not interested in that. "Search google - Don't bother ME!" is the (becoming more and more) typical reply.

Gee, what has this planet sunk to, to become like that?

Ric, yeah, I have a "Trigger Trap" module and am itching to try it. But as it is simply a "programmable shutter timer" it lacks some of the original functions/features that the original one had. But that was a full piece of hardware, now it is/was simply a phone app.
Oh, and they company has now folded/gone broke. :(

Oh, on your mentioning studio flashes......
Does that mean the flash triggers the camera?

I know some flash setups allow multiple flashes and even timing between when certain ones fire for the ONE shot.
I don't quiet get the reason behind that, but there will be one.


A whole project of mine with LEDs came to a screaming halt because as much as it was working: One day I turned it on and it just sat there looking at me with a blank look on its face kind of asking: "What????"

I shall have to sit down one day and write a LOT of programs to find out what went wrong, as there doesn't seem to be anything wrong.



Anyway, I'm really confused in how to handle this latest interest.

Seems I'll have to sit down, do they time and learn all by myself.
(Like there aren't enough already think walls around me.)


(Crawls back under the rock.)

[mpb]

I know some flash setups allow multiple flashes and even timing between when certain ones fire for the ONE shot.
I don't quiet get the reason behind that, but there will be one.


Minolta developed a system, which Sony has continued, where the flash on the camera, either inbuilt flash or attached flash, controls other compatible remote flashes without any other triggers needed.

My understanding is that it is done by the on camera flash sending out a series of light pulses, just before the shutter activates, which the off camera flashes detect and decipher and then fire as required. I don't think you can adjust the timing.

[I @ M]

Mr F, right at this stage I am beginning to the think that the greatest obstacle to you learning is yourself.

I will try to detail what you need to do what you want to do but first you must answer some questions so that I am able to understand your needs.

Q1. What do you want to photograph?

Q2. Do you want to remotely control just a camera or do you want to control a strobe as well.

Q3. If the answer to 2 is both a camera and a strobe, wil the strobe be mounted on the camera or apart from the camera?

[Warbler]

"Search google - Don't bother ME!" is the (becoming more and more) typical reply.

Gee, what has this planet sunk to, to become like that?

If you're not prepared to help yourself, why should I help you? BTW, I've never seen you help anyone else on this site either.

[ameerat42]

And the point is that sometimes "Search Google" IS the best help
that anyone at any given time can offer here.

Try to be careful not to generalise too much from public perceptions,
and worse, impute them wrongly to to colleagues here.

[ricktas]

to answer your question regarding studio lights and being able to fire at different times, they can also be set to fire at different flash strengths.. you wondered why? So that the photographer can create light and shade, movement and stillness. Slow sync (2nd Curtain, and other names) flash can create results as per this: https://digital-photography-school.com/slow-sync-flash/

So the reasons for doing these things, is to get creative results.

and to answer your other part, The flash could trigger the camera, but it could also be that the shuttter triggers the flash. There are thousands of ways to bake a chocolate cake, and it's the same with using flash.

Agree with Andrew above, you need to decide what photographic result you want, then work towards a solution for that result. Cause there is no one way that does it all.

[Mr Felix]

I @ M,

What do I want to photograph?
For now: water drops, smoke, balloons popping.

Camera/strobe control?
I'm not sure. I thought the camera got a "signal" to take the picture then it tells the flashes/strobes to fire.
There seems to be two parts to it.
The triggering of the camera and then the triggering of the flashes/strobes.
For now, I am focused on the camera triggering. I have a 60-70% done system I am building which can trigger the camera to take a picture. I just need to do a bit of work on the inputs. But that isn't too hard. Just the time and other things getting in the way.

Part 3:
Yeah, well, sorry. For now all I have is either the built in flash - rather sad - or a ..... Canon 430EXII flash.

If I can work out the wires/signals for the camera to tell the flash to go "bang!" then I can include external triggers for other lights.
But I think I am getting ahead of myself now.
Coz there are heaps of ways of going that and there are many things already available on the market.
There's no prize for re-inventing the wheel.
I'm more interested in the workings of it just now.
(I'm not sure that really helps, sorry.)



Oh, as I mentioned I do have one of these "Trigger trap" thingies. They are nice, but alas they fell way short of their original potential. Shame really. They did look great.

[I @ M]

Water drops, smoke and balloons popping are 3 differing scenarios as far as triggering a camera / flash.

I am no expert in photographing the 3 scenarios you describe and my opinions are only what I feel will be the best way to go about it.

Photographing smoke would be the least timing "critical" situation I feel and a simple radio or corded shutter release activated by you would suffice. If you want to include flash in a smoke photo and your speedlight is camera mounted then the standard functions will work just fine. If you want to have the flash away from the camera then a simple remote radio transceiver will do the job. Remote transceivers, remote trigger releases, both radio and wired are available in the market place cheaper than you can make one at home.

Photographing balloons popping appears to be the most timing critical exposure. I would assume that a shutter trigger that is activated by the movement of the balloon popping object passing through a laser beam immediately before it hits the balloon would be an appropriate method of shutter actuation. For that you would require a remote sensor to detect the "broken" laser which would command the trigger unit to activate the shutter. The timing of the actuation would be set by the distance from the balloon that the beam is broken.

Photographing water drops could also be done with a movement detection beam to trigger the shutter and as I understand it, dedicated controllers to do that exist to introduce a delay between receival of the triggering signal and the shutter actuation in order to control the moment of droplet formation.

Like you said, you appear to be trying to reinvent the wheel as simple and apparently reliable units to do what you want exist in the market place ----- http://miops.com/

If you are truly bent on creating your own device then a good place to start building appears to be ----- https://www.jaycar.com.au/arduino

Short summary,
you need a device that will allow you to remotely control the time that the shutter opens. If you want to have your speedlight off camera you will also need a device to trigger that as well.
All very basic really except for the controllers that allow a time delay function.

[ricktas]

Smoke.. I will assume incense smoke here cause it produces some amazing swirls and patterns. I have done this photography and you do not need flash.. what you need is continuous light (video lights). The results are acheived using a good strong light source, dark background and if possible darkish room. Get the room setup, lights on, light your incense. Manual focus on the smoke trail. Then use a fast shutter speed to capture the smoke. No need for any form of trigger. Perhaps a remote shutter release to ensure no camera movement, and mirror-up mode, to stop mirror slap.

So 'these tricks' are not really tricks, but just learning how to get the results you want. Oh and when I did them.. I just used Google to find out the best setup and how to. :D

[Mr Felix]

Dunno if it is "on topic" but I have tried to search for the "flash extension cable" which goes between the camera and the flash.

I know there are wireless options, but for now, I would like to keep things as "simple" as possible. For me, that is a cable and not having to get wireless remote control units for the flash and camera.

I tried "canon flash cables" and didn't get anything helpful.

As I am not up to speed with the terms, could someone help me with that they are called?

[Warbler]

5 seconds....

https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=flash+sync+cords&tbm=shop&*

[Mr Felix]

Ah, you have to love modern computers.

From the "link" this is what I get:

See attached.

Shame the terms I am missing are HIDDEN in the link.

[piczzilla]

As I am not up to speed with the terms, could someone help me with that they are called?

TTL cord / TTL flash cord / TTL shoe cord

Also, Some camera pop-up flash can communicate wirelessly with the flash (not sure about your camera).

[Warbler]

Anybody else have trouble clicking on the link?

[jim]

The link takes you to a Google search for Flash Sync Cords.

[Boo53]

Anybody else have trouble clicking on the link?

Took me to a google search with heaps of units available, so a perfectly valid link.

Perhaps the OP should follow your suggestion to get Mr Google to help, at least until he's narrowed down exactly what he wants to achieve and gets a bit of a grip on the basic terms

[Mr Felix]

Well, I showed you what I got when I clicked on it.

No further comment.

[Warbler]

:hb: :rolleyes: