MS Windows 10 - anybody? [Archive] - AusPhotography:: Australia's Premier Photography Forum::

arthurking83

30-07-2015, 3:40pm

Yeah!
I loaded it on my tablet(originally Win7) a few months ago, and love it.
Of course this is obviously the Preview(developer) version, and not the RTM version of Win10, but I made my mind up ages ago that I was going to update my PC from Win7 to Win10 almost ASAP.

My Tablet is very limited on the hardware front(Atom CPU, 2Gb of slow RAM, 32bit only .. etc) and with the old mechanical HDD it was a total slug .. not to mention that Win7 is far from Tablet friendly.

I can report that Win10 is as backward compatible with many old software as Win7 is/was.
I haven't had any issues with ViewNX2(as many of us Nikon software types worry about) nor CaptureNX2.

The main reason I have this Tablet is that I use it to tune the LPG system on my car .. which needs a Windows environment.
The software for the LPG system is written with Win98 in mind, and at some point they also updated it for a Win2000 OS too .. just to highlight the point of how old this software is.
And I've had no problem with it running on Win7 for years, and now Win10(Preview).
USB driver loaded without issue even tho a warning came up saying that this driver wasn't WHQL certified .. etc, etc.

Boot up time for Win10 is half that of Win7 on the tablet too, which is important when battery life is limited.

I do also use the Tablet for photo storage/viewing/sorting if I'm on an extended trip to somewhere, and very very occasionally some browsing and stuff, but it's too small and underpowered to do too much with it in that sense.

As for the security/privacy issues that are sure to make headlines all across the globe .. I'll deal with them as I feel the need too.
And seriously, as if I care that an advertiser that I'm going to ignore(as I always do) is going to know that my machine is the same one as it was the last time they looked!

if this was actually a problem for many folks .. do you think they'd have a facebook/google/twitter account.
I hardly think that this issue is really an issue in this day and age .. they already know who you are .. now M$'s advertising clients will know this too.

ameerat42

30-07-2015, 4:01pm

I'll be holding off on upgrading for as long as possible, I am hearing on a PC forum that a few people are having issues....

Also those that are concerned about their privacy I suggested you have a read of this, it's a little worrying....
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2015/07/29/wind-nos/

A lot of TAr for this, JJ.

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Im on the upgrade path for my laptop only. I wanted to see it and use it on one device before I even think about it on others. So I guess someday soon it will say it has downloaded in the background (3GB download) and that my lappy is ready to upgrade.

Yep. Happened to me with W8.1.

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Good points, AK.

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Gazza. I've bookmarked that link of JJ's too.

macmich

30-07-2015, 5:04pm

same as rick waiting for download to laptop first

Cage

30-07-2015, 5:11pm

It seems like a worthwhile update to W7, unlike W8, but like a lot of others I'll wait a month or so to see what sort of feedback it gets from real world users.

torro

30-07-2015, 5:13pm

I agree with Cage

ricktas

30-07-2015, 6:40pm

hmmmm.

so apparently my laptop is getting it right now

Hawthy

30-07-2015, 6:56pm

I am in the queue to get it. I heard this afternoon that if you don't like it within 30 days, you can revert to your old operating system with no harm done.

ameerat42

30-07-2015, 7:14pm

I wonder if my little old Asus EEE will run it? That has Win 7 --- wait for it --- Starter.:o

I @ M

30-07-2015, 7:23pm

(3GB download)

hmmmm.

so apparently my laptop is getting it right now

Be thankful, with the state of our 'net connection I estimate that a 3gb download would take around 362 days, 12 hours and 32 minutes, all that is irrelevant though because at the 148 days, 6 hours and 15 minute mark the power supply to our hamlet would fail for a minimum of 18 hours ----- :p

Laosie

30-07-2015, 7:30pm

Took an hour to install and that was a painless procedure. My initial impression is very good.

Like:

- the reading view in the new Edge browser
- being able to keep 4 apps/program windows open on the desktop at one time
-for some reason text on web pages and in Word seems easier to read?

Dislike:
-waiting to see if any unpleasant surprises may be lurking.......

Cage

30-07-2015, 7:43pm

Be thankful, with the state of our 'net connection I estimate that a 3gb download would take around 362 days, 12 hours and 32 minutes, all that is irrelevant though because at the 148 days, 6 hours and 15 minute mark the power supply to our hamlet would fail for a minimum of 18 hours ----- :p

Andrew, I feel your frustration.

Until Telstra put in a tower just down the road from me my download speed was approx 1MB per MINUTE, on a good day ! And the bloody thing would drop out at least once, and I would have to dial up again, at a cost of 18c per pop.

ameerat42

30-07-2015, 9:26pm

Sheer lunacy!:crzy: - Or, I just reserved my copy of Win 10:eek::nod:

macmich

30-07-2015, 9:52pm

,running 10 now, 50 minutes to install, now for a good look
cheers macca

ricktas

30-07-2015, 11:04pm

On Win 10 on the laptop right now. So far I quite like it

MissionMan

30-07-2015, 11:16pm

Also running it on my Surface Pro 3. Working very well. A massive improvement on Windows 8 which was dismal.

Filter

31-07-2015, 9:19am

I'm in the queue & will be notified, ricktas when did you join the queue? I've had the message that all my stuff is compatible & will migrate. That's got to be a good thing eh.

Cage

31-07-2015, 10:38am

Any updates or fixes yet ? :lol2:

MissionMan

31-07-2015, 10:54am

If you click on the Windows 10 icon on your menu bar and look at the option check for updates, it seems to force the upgrade early

merlin1

31-07-2015, 11:14am

Haven't been notified of my update yet, can't be long.

Ross.

pyRRhic

31-07-2015, 11:23am

In the last 2 months I have gone from XP SP3 to 8 to 8.1 and 10.0 is pending ... suddenly addicted to bungee jumping. Heartened by the pro 10 over 8 comments.

ameerat42

31-07-2015, 11:26am

Haven't been notified of my update yet, can't be long.

Ross.
Hmm! What ver of Win do you have, Ross?
On the Win 8 screen there is a small icon of 4 tiles on the lower right of the task bar, jut next to the "action Center" flag icon.
If you hover the mouse over this it will read "Get Windows 10". But note that this is just a registration, and you don't get it straightaway.
You're put on a list and... who knows what happens?
Am.

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pS.
i think it's the "updates available" icon.

ricktas

31-07-2015, 12:43pm

I'm in the queue & will be notified, ricktas when did you join the queue? I've had the message that all my stuff is compatible & will migrate. That's got to be a good thing eh.

You can jump the queue. As always, I provide this here for information only and take no responsibility for you using it. Use at your own risk. This is what I used to upgrade.

Click this link (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10), download the 32-bit or 64-bit file as needed. Move the downloaded file to your desktop, right click it and 'run as administrator'. It should then go through the process to upgrade you to Win10. No need to wait in the queue.

antony

31-07-2015, 6:48pm

MissionMan

31-07-2015, 7:51pm

After 10+ years of Apple-only devices, I bought myself a Surface Pro 3 few weeks back. One of the first things during initial setup of Surface Pro 3 is to make sure I am not registered for Windows 10.

(Despite OS X 10.11 El Capitan is on its way very soon, my main computer - Mac Pro is still running OS X 10.9 Mavericks.)

I can live without the latest of the latest.

Upgrade it. I've been running Windows 8 on the surface pro 3 for nearly a year and it's the biggest piece of shit to grace computer hardware, second maybe to only Windows ME.

The Surface is a great piece of hardware, really good quality but the OS lets it down. Even with Windows 10 as a new OS, it's still so far ahead of Windows that I could feel my body physically sigh with relief when I installed Windows 10 and started up for the first time.

ameerat42

31-07-2015, 7:53pm

Why do you find it so, MM? I am worried now that I might have to suddenly wash my hands.
I also can't figure out why Antony would want to disable the upgrade notification.
Am(worried:eek:).

MissionMan

31-07-2015, 7:59pm

Not sure if you misunderstood but I was recommending the upgrade to Windows 10 as its great. It's how how the Surface Pro 3 should have been released to started with.

Windows 8 on the other hand was disjointed, unintuitive, constantly required a mouse in tablet mode or touch screen in mouse mode, that it became evident that it was designed by a geek with no usability experience.

Does Windows 10 have issues? Yes but they are honestly really minor.

ameerat42

31-07-2015, 8:02pm

antony

31-07-2015, 10:30pm

Upgrade it. I've been running Windows 8 on the surface pro 3 for nearly a year and it's the biggest piece of shit to grace computer hardware, second maybe to only Windows ME. I haven't even had Surface Pro 3 for 1 month yet. I will play with 8.1 for a bit longer. Just starting to get used Windows 8.1.

Can I revert back to 8.1 if I don't like Windows 10?

I admit I haven't used Surface Pro 3 that much. Still using Mac and iPads 95% of the time.

MissionMan

31-07-2015, 10:51pm

Yeah. The window 8 restore files remain on your machine

MissionMan

01-08-2015, 1:54pm

OK, I'm glad you clarified it, MM. AFAICS, you mean the experience with this tablet. I can only say that on the Zenbook I have it's been the best OS
I can remember. It's been stable, fast, things happen that you expect... - other things I can't recall. Sure, as soon as I got it I set it up straight
for Desktop appearance.
Am.

Nope, I mean with Windows 8 in generally. I have to say it's honestly surprising. You may be the first person I've met that actually likes Windows 8. Everyone I know hates it. I sat next to someone last night who told me he returned his laptop to JB hifi because he found Windows 8 virtually unusable.

ricktas

01-08-2015, 3:03pm

Nope, I mean with Windows 8 in generally. I have to say it's honestly surprising. You may be the first person I've met that actually likes Windows 8. Everyone I know hates it. I sat next to someone last night who told me he returned his laptop to JB hifi because he found Windows 8 virtually unusable.

I would agree. I have used Win 8 a couple of times only and hated it. So I stuck with Win7. M$ seem to do a good job of every second version of their OS. I have leapfrogged through the ages.

ameerat42

01-08-2015, 4:09pm

But do you use it in Apps:eek: mode or just in Desktop:)? I use it the latter way, and it's hardly different from the other
versions I've used. I will say that I cannot stand the Apps mode. In fact, I set it to start in desktop mode:nod:.

Here is a pic of it with a bonus File Explorer screen open:D
118847

(PS: I knew you'd like it.)

bcys1961

01-08-2015, 5:50pm

I upgraded to Windows 10.

A warning that may help some others !!!!!!!!.

After the upgrade my laptop was running very slow on startup and once the desktop came up I got the Blue Screen of Death with a warning about Internal Power Error . The computer shut down , restarted and the same thing kept happening over and over again. It was in a constant death spiral!!!

Obviously I'm not very happy and the expletives used I will reserve for Microsoft only!!!

After finding and firing up my old laptop to access google I managed to fix the problem. Apparently the new Windows 10 was not compatible with my graphics driver .

So to fix problem - before the blue screen of death appears you need to quickly disable your graphics driver ( use device manager) . This stops the crashing . Then use the update driver command to download and install the new driver.

Now it all works and I'm happy , but it would be nice if MS somehow sorthed these problems out first and told you before you did the upgrade.

Anyway , a potential warning for others .

( I'm using a Toshiba Laptop with AMD graphics card/driver).

ameerat42

01-08-2015, 7:13pm

Ta Brad. Only the kiss of death from Mr Goldfinger would be worse than the dreaded BLUE SCREEN!:eek:

J.davis

02-08-2015, 12:09am

Clean install and I am happy so far. Desktop PC.

arthurking83

02-08-2015, 12:29am

....

( I'm using a Toshiba Laptop with AMD graphics card/driver).

Which AMD chip?(and which driver version?)

Technically, the driver is software that the OS installs to communicate with the actual hardware.
It sounds like you did an install over another Windows installation, and not a clean install of Win10.
But even at that, Windows will almost always install a generic, lowest common denominator type driver, which results in a screen reminiscent of the 80's .. at about 400x640 at 16bit colour
You then update the graphics chip driver to allow more detailed display characteristics, and set display settings to something more usable.
So did the problem begin immediately after initial bootup, or id it only start after you installed the AMD driver for the graphics chip?

I have a couple of PC's with AMD graphics chips.

will check to see if they are compatible before any updates for them.

bcys1961

02-08-2015, 4:54am

Which AMD chip?(and which driver version?)

No idea? My technical knowledge of computers is binary - they either work , or don't work.

I simply followed the prompts provided by the small windows icon in the tool bar , which did the upgrade for me , so yes Ver 10 was installed over the top of Ver 8 . Reading forums it looks like Ver 10 installs an out of date , or incompatible driver , which then needs to be updated.

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Which AMD chip?(and which driver version?)

No idea? My technical knowledge of computers is binary - they either work , or don't work.

I simply followed the prompts provided by the small windows icon in the tool bar , which did the upgrade for me , so yes Ver 10 was installed over the top of Ver 8 . Reading forums it looks like Ver 10 installs an out of date , or incompatible driver , which then needs to be updated.

ricktas

02-08-2015, 7:36am

Interesting Brad. I upgraded my editing desktop computer yesterday, and first go the install failed and said 'something happened' and that my graphics driver needed updating, when I clicked on 'next' it took me to the driver site page (for AMD catalyst) so I just had to download and update. Then when I re-ran the upgrade it worked perfectly.

Sounds like M$ offer support during the upgrade for some drivers etc, and not others.

enseth

02-08-2015, 9:58am

Anybody interested in setting their privacy setting with Windows 10 might find this useful. It's a fair read but worth the effort if you're concerned about these sort of things.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/

Click this link (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10), download the 32-bit or 64-bit file as needed. Move the downloaded file to your desktop, right click it and 'run as administrator'
Thanks for this post Rick. It seems the download wont work if you just click the button. I'll now try the method you suggest

arthurking83

02-08-2015, 9:59am

No idea? My technical knowledge of computers is binary - they either work , or don't work.

....Reading forums it looks like Ver 10 installs an out of date , or incompatible driver , which then needs to be updated.

AH! ok then.

FWIW: the actual device(the graphics chip) will be listed in the Device Manager section of Control Panel.
Control Panel->Device Manager-><scroll list down to display adapters in the list> click Display Adapters{and it should be called ATI or AMD something-or-other}

eg. Mine is called ATI Radeon 4290
That's the chip model type. And if you're ever looking for updated drivers that's what you'd search for, or install for.
(ie. when in doubt, always consult your Device Manager)

And another thing to be mindful of too. It's not always Window's/M$'s fault too.
Usually when there's a driver issue of some sort, it's more so due to the device(PC) manufacturer, and or the peripheral device(the specific part that's causing the issue) manufacturer.

I get this all the time on some devices.
eg. on my Gigabyte tablet they've used a Realtek ethernet chip. I look for drivers for this ethernet device to work properly in the gigabit speed range.
The tablet manufacturer does something to disallow the installation of the generic driver from Realtek(the company that makes the actual LAN hardware and driver) and I can only install Gigabytes latest driver version.
The problem is, Gigabyte's driver is much older .. and could be the cause of the not so quick wired LAN speeds this tablet gives me.
The issue could be any number of things actually, but the issue here is that Gigabyte won't allow the installation of the peripheral device manufacturers driver.

So not all bad things in an M$ world are simply due to M$!
I'm not defending M$ here, other than to explain that their task is made massively difficult because of the monumental variety of products available for the system!

Warbler

02-08-2015, 10:04am

Five hours to upgrade, and then it crashes on rebooting. Grrrr! Finally get it working and it looks like crap. I truly can't see what all the hype was about. The only nice thing I can say about it is that I didn't have to go and re-activate all my other software this time, and it kept all my settings. Oh, and my screen calibrator is no longer recognised.

bricat

02-08-2015, 10:32am

Can't find anything wrong with w7 on my laptop. Anytime someone wants you to upgrade it costs you money. Maybe not now but it will. Something won't work so you buy a new one. And then the learning curve for the new system. Might wait till I buy a new laptop and my guess is this will outlive me.

MissionMan

02-08-2015, 11:10am

arthurking83

02-08-2015, 11:44am

The impact is probably not that noticeable unless you have a tablet. ...

And even more so if that tablet is limited in it's hardware capabilities.

Like I said earlier, on my Atom powered tablet(previously Win7 too) .. it's much faster to load up into a usable state and a teeny bit more responsive with most tasks.

I've yet to read of any hype(or hyperbole) as of yet, and my experience so far(not yet on the desktop) are positive as opposed to glowing.
The biggest deal tho is coming from Win7 on a tablet(which is next to unusable as a tablet OS) .. Win10 is much better by at least one order of magnitude.

My kids both have tablet-laptops(ie. hybrid) PC for(and from) school, which both use Win8.1.
Don't like them at all, and are quite sluggish even tho they have much more superior hardware(RAM, CPU, etc)

But they are chock full with so much software which probably makes a difference too tho(Photoshop, Office .. etc) so much bloated stuff probably taking up some system resources somewhere in the background.
Can't do anything about it tho as they're both managed by the school.

One other thing about any Win10 users out there at the moment.
Has anyone used Edge yet(if you're the typical Windows Explorer avoider)?

I'm pretty much devoted to Firefox for so many reasons ... features, security open source, etc ... but on the tablet it's usually a bit slow to load and operate.(most likely due to RAM)
So far tho, Edge blows it away for speed/responsiveness, and I'm actually contemplating sticking with it for a while and not reloading FF again.
I had FF on the Preview version of Win10, but wasn't impressed having then used Edge.

One other thing for me tho is that I always do full clean installs for any OS upgrade.
Been bitten too many times with updated/refresh installations of an OS ... just for the sake of not having to reinstall software and re activating that software.
reinstalling software is trivial by comparison to having driver and software issues later on if some other conflict arises.

Warbler

02-08-2015, 1:02pm

The impact is probably not that noticeable unless you have a tablet. Did you come from Windows 8 or 7?

Win 7 Ultimate 64. I think I'll be restoring to that too. When something so basic as Windows Explorer is unrecogniseable, I sniff young marketing suits with no bloody idea. I really can't see anything "better" about it, or "quicker". Might be great for the mobile phone brigade who feel the occasional need to make a desktop machine look like their phone, but it does nothing for power users.

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I just found that copy to folder option. It was Microsoft Edge that didn't have it, not Explorer. I thought MS might have learned it's lesson when it changed the Office User Interface and causes lots of retraining costs for businesses unnecessarily. Man, I wonder what the global productivity costs have been since this upgrade became available. :rolleyes:

ameerat42

02-08-2015, 4:34pm

...Like I said earlier, on my Atom powered tablet(previously Win7 too) .. it's much faster to load up into a usable state and a teeny bit more responsive with most tasks.

...
The biggest deal tho is coming from Win7 on a tablet(which is next to unusable as a tablet OS) .. Win10 is much better by at least one order of magnitude.

...

Oh, goody! This bodes well for my Win 7 "Starter" EEE Netbook!:D

nixworries

02-08-2015, 5:17pm

Like windows 10 so far but had trouble with the Nvidia graphics, it takes 2 reboots to get it to load the driver.

enseth

02-08-2015, 7:49pm

All went well with the install. Seems quite good although I have found a problem with Flickr using Edge. It looks like it has a bug using the BB Code share function. The dialogue box doesn't show properly. I ended up having to use Chrome.

merlin1

02-08-2015, 8:12pm

Ameerat42, I am running win 7 pro at the moment.

Ross.

ameerat42

02-08-2015, 8:49pm

Hmm! Dunno what sort of upgrade notification you get with Win 7, Ross. If you look at my post 37 in this thread,
the picture there shows the Win 8.1 desktop screen. At the lower right, the 3rd icon in from the left is the update
notification icon.

However, if you want to get it, don't worry about notifications. Go to the site Rick has mentioned in post 27.

Am.

merlin1

02-08-2015, 9:00pm

Just checked my update list, in the last 4 days Upgrade to Windows 10 Pro is listed 7 times as failed. Error code 80240020. When I followed the prompt to check the code, no answer was the stern reply.

Ross.

ameerat42

02-08-2015, 9:06pm

It's something common. - Some corruption in the Win update folder on your computer.

Google search on just "Error code 80240020". There are heaps of refs and fixes.

merlin1

02-08-2015, 10:12pm

Thanks I will do that in the morning.

Ross.

Warbler

03-08-2015, 11:24am

And now I have this problem. My Outlook won't send email anymore. It will send test messages but all my replies are still in the Outbox with sending errors. What a PITA.

http://www.msoutlook.info/question/cannot-send-after-windows-10-upgrade

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The above fix worked for me too. I can now send email. Pity the damn machine won't reboot without a disc though. More work required. I wonder what the impact to Global GDP has been with this release.

pixelsaurus

03-08-2015, 11:36am

I think I'm going to give Win 10 a big miss, at least on my Win 7 machine. There appears to be issues with drivers relating to dedicated astro CCD cams and telescope control (ASCOM). Also it would appear that auto updates can't be disabled and my astro chums tell me there is nothing more annoying than having an imaging run cancelled because Windows wants an update. As I'm in a rural district, I'm not at all happy with the idea that MS may want to share my internet connection.

Kym

03-08-2015, 1:33pm

Updated two machines, all goodness

Win 7 users might want this http://8gadgetpack.net/

merlin1

03-08-2015, 3:24pm

Downloading windows 10 now, been going for 2 hours.

Ross

arthurking83

03-08-2015, 6:26pm

Downloading windows 10 now, been going for 2 hours.

Ross

Yeah, if you don't have a fast connection it'll take 'forever'.

I've downloaded a couple of USB installations and an ISO. USB installs are about 4Gig, and the ISO(both x86 and x64) is over 6Gig.

From memory the ISO(6Gig) took a couple of hours on a fairly quick cable connection.

ApolloLXII

04-08-2015, 5:54am

I'm going to wait a few months before downloading it. There are always numerous bugs that have to be ironed out whenever a new OS has been released so I'll hang back and get the patched up version when they've fixed any issues.

Filter

04-08-2015, 4:39pm

Up & running with win 10, jury is out with edge atm will have to do some work to customize before switching over....if at all

MissionMan

04-08-2015, 4:53pm

Up & running with win 10, jury is out with edge atm will have to do some work to customize before switching over....if at all

I think edge isn't bad. It's not what I would consider a replacement for Chrome, but it's better than the shitty tablet browser they had before this. I could probably do 80% of what I need in edge.

merlin1

04-08-2015, 8:57pm

Finally on line with 10. Downloaded after I cleaned out the update download folder.
All working perfectly.

Ross.

ameerat42

04-08-2015, 8:58pm

Good to hear, Ross.

antony

05-08-2015, 12:14am

Yeah. The window 8 restore files remain on your machine

According to Windows 10 Q&A (http://www.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/windows-10-faq) page,
http://ant.sillydog.org/pix/temp/ss_win10_q_a_revert_20150803.png
The option to revert back is only available for one month.

Also from Surface support (http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-au/support/warranty-service-and-recovery/restore-or-reset-surface?os=windows-10) page,
http://ant.sillydog.org/pix/temp/ss_surface3_support_win10_20150803.png
Since Surface Pro 3 does not come with Windows 8.1 disc, I take that Restore factory settings is the only option. And I will lose all my documents/applications (to get back to Windows 8.1 Pro)?

So if I take the upgrade plunge, the option of reverting back to Windows 8.1 are:
do so within one month; or
(after one month) Restore Surface Pro 3 and lose every applications and documents (and all other settings I presume).
Am I correct on this?

Kym

05-08-2015, 12:24am

Oh, and my screen calibrator is no longer recognised.

I had to uninstall and then install the latest Spyder 4 software -- the recalibrate -- then ok

Kym

05-08-2015, 12:25am

MissionMan

05-08-2015, 12:46am

According to Windows 10 Q&A (http://www.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/windows-10-faq) page,
http://ant.sillydog.org/pix/temp/ss_win10_q_a_revert_20150803.png
The option to revert back is only available for one month.

Also from Surface support (http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-au/support/warranty-service-and-recovery/restore-or-reset-surface?os=windows-10) page,
http://ant.sillydog.org/pix/temp/ss_surface3_support_win10_20150803.png
Since Surface Pro 3 does not come with Windows 8.1 disc, I take that Restore factory settings is the only option. And I will lose all my documents/applications (to get back to Windows 8.1 Pro)?

So if I take the upgrade plunge, the option of reverting back to Windows 8.1 are:
do so within one month; or
(after one month) Restore Surface Pro 3 and lose every applications and documents (and all other settings I presume).
Am I correct on this?

Realistically you should be backing up data (if you aren't, start now) so all you lose is applications and settings. If you are worried about it, do a full backup of everything including your installation. There is cloning software that would allow for it.

ricktas

05-08-2015, 6:40am

antony

05-08-2015, 11:36am

Realistically you should be backing up data (if you aren't, start now) so all you lose is applications and settings. If you are worried about it, do a full backup of everything including your installation. There is cloning software that would allow for it.:oops: I should.
I haven't performed many 'proper' backups ever since Apple released Time Machine feature back in OS X 10.5 Leopard.

So, back to my question... if I don't liking Windows 10 after one month, reverting Surface Pro 3 back to Windows 8.1 would be sort of a hassle.

(I started to wonder why I bought the Surface at the first place.)

Agree, backing up tablet/phone data should be treated the same as backing up photos, or other information you have stored on computers. I backup my phone and tablet data (contacts, call logs, messages, emails, and calendar) every two weeks. Other stuff like word docs, photos, videos, etc are backed up to dropbox on the fly.I don't do backup religiously. iTunes does the backup for my iPhone and iPad.

ameerat42

05-08-2015, 11:47am

...So, back to my question... if I don't liking Windows 10 after one month, reverting Surface Pro 3 back to Windows 8.1 would be sort of a hassle...

(Only on the surface, at least:p)

MissionMan

05-08-2015, 11:54am

:oops: I should.
I haven't performed many 'proper' backups ever since Apple released Time Machine feature back in OS X 10.5 Leopard.

So, back to my question... if I don't liking Windows 10 after one month, reverting Surface Pro 3 back to Windows 8.1 would be sort of a hassle.

(I started to wonder why I bought the Surface at the first place.)

I don't do backup religiously. iTunes does the backup for my iPhone and iPad.

I have both Mac and PC so I'm in the same boat. My mac is backed up by time machine and to an online storage facility. All my documents on my surface pro are backed up to dropbox which in turn syncs with my mac and is backed up to an online facility. If you do the same with this (not sure if the SP3 is a replacement to your mac or to be used in conjunction with it), then backups shouldn't be an issue. At worst, if you want to restore, you should be able to use the download the restore files for the SP3 with Windows 8.1 and restore it to its original format and all your data and documents should be online (icloud/exchange or dropbox).

Personally, having used the SP3 on windows 8.1, I would rather deal with a slightly buggy windows 10 than a stable windows 8.1

If you do work with Windows 8.1 on the SP3, I'd recommend start8 to get back to a normal start menu.

Biggest thing I miss from my mac on the SP3 is spotlight.

antony

05-08-2015, 1:04pm

... (not sure if the SP3 is a replacement to your mac or to be used in conjunction with it), then backups shouldn't be an issue.
Backup isn't an issue, however I will admit that I've been lazy.

Not to replace my Mac, but I haven't had a 'proper' PC for 10+ years (apart from running Parallels). I guess it was the stylus for SP3 that got me into it. The stylus for iPads don't work that well, even with the bluetooth version. Initially looking for cheap tablet, but ended up with SP3, telling myself I do have a few Windows-only applications.
(And I don't use the Surface Pen all that often afterwards.)

Biggest thing I miss from my mac on the SP3 is spotlight.
The key feature I miss is Quick Look (select a file on Finder, and press the spacebar for quick preview)... been hitting the spacebar many times on SP3.

MissionMan

05-08-2015, 1:24pm

Backup isn't an issue, however I will admit that I've been lazy.

Not to replace my Mac, but I haven't had a 'proper' PC for 10+ years (apart from running Parallels). I guess it was the stylus for SP3 that got me into it. The stylus for iPads don't work that well, even with the bluetooth version. Initially looking for cheap tablet, but ended up with SP3, telling myself I do have a few Windows-only applications.
(And I don't use the Surface Pen all that often afterwards.)

The key feature I miss is Quick Look (select a file on Finder, and press the spacebar for quick preview)... been hitting the spacebar many times on SP3.

You can set up the preview on the side of the screen, that is the closest you can get to the spacebar. I prefer the space as well.

The pen also got me into it. OneNote integration with the stylus is incredible.

If you end up needing a decent search application for windows, X1 is the best I have found to date.

That said, if Apple released something like this, I would replace this in a heartbeat.

Kym

05-08-2015, 1:48pm

http://blogs.adobe.com/crawlspace/2015/07/photoshop-and-lightroom-compatibility-with-windows-10.html#comment-42616

Photoshop and Lightroom compatibility with Windows 10 Windows 10 was released today. To answer questions about compatibility, Adobe has create an FAQ (https://helpx.adobe.com/creative-cloud/kb/Windows_10_compatibility_FAQ.html).
The Photoshop and Lightroom teams have been testing our applications since Windows 10 became available to developers. In our testing, we have found no significant issues with running Creative Cloud products or Lightroom 6 with Windows 10.
Earlier versions of Photoshop (CS6) were also tested to a lesser extent and no significant issues were discovered.
I personally recommend that customers do their own testing on a non-production partition to ensure that new OSes work with their current hardware and drivers.
If you do encounter issues not already documented, feel free to report them on our feedback site (http://feedback.photoshop.com/).

antony

05-08-2015, 3:43pm

MissionMan,
Thank you for the start8 and X1 suggestion, and answering all upgrading question.

I will play with Windows 8.1 for a bit longer on SP3, since I haven't had it for that long yet.

MissionMan

05-08-2015, 4:51pm

Both of them have 30 day trials so you should be able to test them first.

From what I hear Windows 10 has SP1 coming out end of July so that may be enough to tide you over till the arrival of SP1.

chappo1

05-08-2015, 5:01pm

What about drivers for all the peripheral stuff? Scanners, printers and such? I know just enough to be a danger to myself so I am hanging back. Yes it is supposed to work but what if it does not?...john

Filter

05-08-2015, 5:15pm

My win 10 experience was short lived, I believe I have a clean system (well sort of...) & things should have worked. I had Office Outlook hang up/freeze on a few occasions. The start menu would only work once after start up then nothing & when my CS6 (sort of original) would not start I decided I would revert to win 7 for awhile longer. I understand most of the issues can be worked around if you had an ounce of savvy, I'm just short of the ounce...lol. I will be monitoring progress from members...

Hawthy

06-08-2015, 9:19pm

DacrimL

06-08-2015, 9:25pm

Have just finished with the upgrade to 10 and am happy to a point. Whilst the d/l, install and setup only took a mere 90 minutes everything seems to be working fine except Lightroom CC, so am uninstalling and reinstalling to see if that fixes the problem.

But from what I can see of W10......yes it is faster (once programs & apps have been initialized for the first time)
It currently looks cleaner than any other previous versions of Windows
and I like the fact that the old start menu has returned

Kym

06-08-2015, 9:29pm

It seems most are having little or no issues with Win 10

The main issues are:

Old versions of software or drivers
Broken starting point (corrupt Win 7 or Win 8.1)
Some applications need to be reinstalled (eg. Spyder)

Most are very easily fixed. Some configuration changes are needed to make it do what you want.

After a few days I like it much better than 8.1 and my wife is happy enough having used Win 7 previously.

ricktas

06-08-2015, 9:36pm

After a few days I like it much better than 8.1 and my wife is happy enough having used Win 7 previously.

Me too. It appears to be a good stable OS, working well for me.

DacrimL

06-08-2015, 9:49pm

Hmmm, no good I'm afraid, have posted a request for help here

http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?141131-Lightroom-CC-Error&p=1308254#post1308254

merlin1

08-08-2015, 11:42am

Windows 10 online now for a few days, no probs with any apps. Seems windows did any upgrades that were needed. Boots up in 12 seconds, windows 7 took 6 minutes if I was lucky. Only thing that doesn't work is Comp does not go to sleep any more, even though it is set to do so.
Norton said not to use Edge as they haven't sorted some extensions, What ever that means????.

Ross.

arthurking83

08-08-2015, 12:23pm

Windows 10 online now for a few days, no probs with any apps. Seems windows did any upgrades that were needed. Boots up in 12 seconds, windows 7 took 6 minutes if I was lucky......
The difference in bootup time in reality is not that much.
A few seconds maybe, but not measured in so many minutes.

What you're experiencing is a bloated OS environment(in Win7).

Over time as you install software, and add remove all manner of stuff, Windows boot up takes progressively longer.
As you use Win10 more and add/remove all manner of stuff again, only time will tell if the advantage is real.

My tablet(of very low specs) is probably a more real indication of bootup time differences.
I keep it very lean, predominantly for a very few specific purposes, and it's has hardly any programs installed.

Bootup is quicker, but the difference is more like 30 sec .. maybe 1 minute quicker.
With Win7 it was geenrally between 1-2minutes before the circular 'wait' icon would fully disappear.
With Win 10 maybe 20-30sec or so.

I recently reinstalled Win 7 on my desktop and bootup time with all manner of junk installed again is also about 30-ish seconds again. Was at least 2-3minutes before the refresh.

ameerat42

08-08-2015, 12:46pm

I will await your collective :lol2: on the head when I tell you my laptop is 10 sec bootup. OW! OUCH!
(Will it help if I tell you it's still on W 8.1?- Ouch! I guess not :(.)

arthurking83

08-08-2015, 2:34pm

speedier boot times in Windows were introduced with Win8(pity that OS isn't really suited well for desktop environments)

Apparently the proliferation of tablets devices and their relatively fast boot up times forced M$ to work on this issue.
The reality is that those mobile devices(phones/tablets/etc) actually are painfully slow to boot up from the off state, but hardly anyone ever truly turns them off .. and instead simply places them into a deep sleep mode.

So M$'s solution(as I've read when Win8 was initially announced) was to load up the most essential items(drivers, services, etc) and then allow you some control of the OS(eg. load a browser, file, software) and finish the OS requirements in the background.

Up to Win7, all services and drivers had to be loaded before the OS would react to any input, hence the feeling that it loaded was of course slower.
On the tablet with minimal reources and battery life .. this could have been excruciating .. especially with a slow mechanical HDD(5200RPM).

I tried a 7200RPM drive, and this improved boot times, but had to remove it to install it into a dead Laptop .. so I got a Samsung SSD .. and bootup times fell to about 1/4 of those with the old slow HDD. roughly 30sec .. maybe 1min .... compared to at least 2mins with the slow HDD.
Made the tablet actually useful for other purposes .. except large spreadsheets.

Win 10 improves that to about 10-30sec to a usable state.

The problem with testing this accurately was that something like a process or device would always change the actual boot up time to a usable state .. such as an update, or device accidentally left attached.
The most annoying bootup slow down process has almost always been any screen calibration software.
Then of course you have any bloated Office startup crap that loads itself by default .. and so on and etc.

ameerat42

08-08-2015, 2:38pm

OFFice is OFF this machine, and Open Office is on instead.

Yes, this machine sports an "Instant ON" facility and at present reads, "Standby 10 days".

I was just pleased NOT to have to wait 3-4 mins to actually get to do something

Cage

08-08-2015, 3:23pm

My W7 used to boot up in less than 20 seconds when new, now takes more than twice as long, due I'm sure to 18 months of accumulated crud.

Have been putting off a fresh instal and will delay again till I decide to go with W10.

geoffsta

08-08-2015, 7:01pm

Have found one problem (Not sure if it has been said) Microsoft Edge.... Works great.. Until you want to write on this forum.... Went back to IE...

ApolloLXII

11-08-2015, 8:39pm

Well I took the plunge and updated my laptop to Windows 10. So far, so good but I'll wait a bit longer before I upgrade my desktop PC and see how things go on the laptop. I think that this is the OS that Microsoft should have developed instead of wasting time with the abomination that was Vista. It's taken them some time to realise that, while a nice, shiny OS looks good on the screen, it ended up being limited by the capacity of the hardware used to run it. 8, 8.1 and 10 are proof that functionality is more important than a good look. I'm so glad that they have decided to reinstate the start button and ditch the stupid Charms that would pop up on the side of the screen when you didn't want them to. It's still only early days with Windows 10 but, so far, I'm liking what I see. :nod:

bricat

12-08-2015, 6:03am

I run W7 and W8.1 on the one laptop. I use W7 predominately. So I decided to upgrade 8.1 to 10. Within 24 hours my laptop locked up. After mucking around for an hour or so I managed to get it started and went back to W8.1. Now my load/start time has double as the computer searches for W10. Have just upgraded my SSD to Samsung 850 pro 512GB as the Corsair 120 gb was at capacity. It will probably take me hours to figure out how to clean this all up without doing a clean install. The joys of having a computer...cheers Brian

ricktas

12-08-2015, 7:35am

Found an issue I am going to have to investigate further.

If you have two (or more possibly) user accounts on a Win 10 machine, and none of the user accounts have passwords, when you start the computer up it does not give you a choice of accounts to login to, it just logs into one, and you then have to logout to get logged into the other one. I have not tested this where user accounts have passwords etc yet.

Googling shows there are a few people with this issue but so far have not found a solution. And from what I can tell it logs into the account username that is earliest in the alphabet. So if you had account called Kelly and Andrew, Andrew's account would get logged in, it it was Maria and Marvin, Maria's would get logged in. But have not confirmed it is alphabetical, but from the two machines of friends experiencing this, it has been the account closest to A that gets auto logged on. It could be a different method of selection on which account, but from my limited observations, I surmise it could be alphabet based.

ricktas

12-08-2015, 7:40am

Just confirmed that if one account has a password, the other account that doesn't gets logged on automatically.

Warbler

12-08-2015, 8:14am

I had to uninstall my Wi-Fi Drivers on my Toshiba laptop too. Still finding stuff I have to fix. Had one of those unfortunate coincidences on my desktop too. Install new software and have a simultaneous hardware failure. Got a dodgy RAM slot. Tested the modules in different slots and they all work, but the slot is dead, so down to 24gb instead of 32. Some applications don't work as they once did and some settings have not been retained.

Think of the productivity hit that this has caused world-wide. :eek:

macmich

12-08-2015, 8:19am

what would happen if it was rick and rick

arthurking83

12-08-2015, 9:49am

Aha!
On my son's laptop, we both have accounts and both have passwords.
I installed W10 under my son's name(via Win7).
At the login prompt now in W10 tho, it automatically assumes that my son is the default user, so the login prompt is for him.

If I want to login under my username, there is a quick link to me profile in the lower LH corner.

So my assumption is if there were multiple accounts under Win<X> where X = the previous version, and you updated as opposed to clean installed then the default user will be the one that updated from the previous version.

I dunno about Win8, as my kid's school tablets were set by the school .. but that I know if in Win7 the username that initiated the installation seems to become the default login.
That's how my daughter's laptop boots up too. The login screen defaults to her login prompt, where all she has to do is supply her password ... and with an option for me to login if I need too as well.

My desktop and tablet don't have multiple users.

I installed W10 on my son's laptop too the other day and the driver or software for the touchpad stopped working!
Had to frantically find a mouse to work with and tried a bluetooth one I have lying around.
I could get to all the necessary menus in the devices/bluetooth area to pair with it except the most important one. There was no way to use the keyboard to actually enable the pair radio button! Arrghhhh!

So I had to find a USB mouse, to connect so that I could finally hit the pair button to pair the bluetooth mouse so I could navigate easily around the network to find the touchpad software/driver to reinstall it all again.

A bloody mess .. but in the end all good. Everything works as s'posed too now.
Bootup time is a bit slower on his laptop tho, and I suspect because of the updated installation as opposed to the clean boot method(I used on my tablet).

ameerat42

12-08-2015, 10:33am

what would happen if it was rick and rick

I reckon you'd have a lot of hay (https://www.google.com.au/search?q=hay+rick&biw=1920&bih=922&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=0CCsQsARqFQoTCOHWgeGloscCFQEfpgodAWQJBQ):nod:

MissionMan

12-08-2015, 10:42am

Hearing about the bugs with upgrades supports Apple's logic of tying hardware and software together. It's not to say it's bug free, but it's less likely to incorporate bugs because the software is already tested with the hardware. Explains why my Surface Pro 3 upgrade was flawless as well.

arthurking83

13-08-2015, 2:47pm

One ever so slight bug for my desktop.
I went ahead and went with the refresh/upgrade path(rather than full install) for now. My current Win7 was a recent install, so I just wanna see how quickly it boots and operates for now.
Will do a clean install again very soon .. and it gives me a little time to try out more software(trial versions) again :p

One small bug for me on the desktop too was that the video driver(AMD/Radeon 4940) for some reason didn't migrate to the Win10 environment :confused013
Can't imagine why .. everything else is fine and dandy according to Device Manager .. even the silly old PL2303 USB to Serial driver worked fine .. something I use once in 5 or so years!

So on bootup into Win10 for the first time, I saw the typical mickey mouse 800x600 plain jane graphics of days long gone.
Took a couple of minutes to search for and load the latest driver for the graphics card, and all good.

Speed so far seems ok .. much better than my son's laptop by way of comparison too, even tho both out Win7 installs were about as recent as each others and I install and remove way more evaluation software than he does.

I don't buy the Apple system of software upgrades tied in with hardware as well.
Theoretically, in an Apple world it should never happen as they already have the control over the issue and by rights should have tested it. In effect they are really the major vendor that can do this.
In the Win environment, it's almost always up to a third party vendor if they want to provide the customer service that goes along with the hardware you have.
M$ can't force any vendor to update their driver/hardware I guess.

So, with respect to my PS2303 USB to serial device(it's just a cable to connect to my car's electronics).
I suspect that somewhere along the line M$ had some similarly compatible driver for some obscure similar device too.
The original creators of the PL2303 devices which use this driver probably couldn't be stuffed to update the driver, but M$ took it upon themselves to provide one.
The driver name is a bit different TTL236 or whatever it was, but good to see that M$ isn't so lazy about all things.

The one thing that did infuriate me with this current OS refresh tho is that I took the time to check for any updates prior to installing Win10.
With the Radeon 4940 driver already installed in Win7 and working fine, why didn't it pick up on this device.
The during the installation I noticed another attempt at searching for updates. (updates to what?)
It slowed the process by at least half an hour (about 15mins each) .. as a shower and breakfast were done and dusted during those excruciatingly long update searches.

ricktas

13-08-2015, 7:21pm

re the multiple users. I have replicated it now, and no it was not the signed in user that became the default, it again is the user who's username comes first in the alphabet. Remembering that there is not a password set for either account. I am doing some experimenting on an older laptop that doesnt really matter if I brick it.

Re doing users called the same name Rick and Rick...Crap no..one of me is quite sufficient!

Warbler

14-08-2015, 9:25am

Here's another small issue I've found with win 10. If you select UK English as your language, EXCEL defaults to the pound sterling instead of dollars in the currency format for cells, or at least on Office 2007 it does.

ameerat42

14-08-2015, 9:41am

But carn'tcha select English Austraya?:cool::cool: - Or would that give us a Roo-bles symbol:rolleyes: Hmm!

Warbler

14-08-2015, 10:11am

Wasn't an option when I installed from a disc. Something about Cortana as I recall. Fixed now, but just another "thing" that has to be done afterwards. I just got a notification that there is a new Windows 10 driver from nVidia available for download now too for those with video issues.

arthurking83

14-08-2015, 10:27am

LOL, yeah .. and has anyone found a way to remove that annoying ENG icon in the notification area?

Ezookiel

14-08-2015, 1:56pm

On my Surface 3 Pro, Photoshop all but stopped working, it would take over 3 minutes to load. Premiere Pro stopped working at all, and then I couldn't redownload either of them because of errors it would give on most downloads.
Nothing would fix it until I returned to Windows 8.
Windows 10 doesn't work well with the Surface Pro 3 so far as I can see. It was an endless pain in my side with problems.
I'm back on 8 and will have to stay there a while until I see evidence the W10 is working properly.

Speedway

14-08-2015, 2:02pm

Did the upgrade yesterday. Only problem was the telstra wireless USB modem was not recognized, unplugged and restarted computer, reconnected modem and it was recognized. When I logged on this morning the modem was not recognized again, tried the disconnect and restart again to no avail. Rang telstra support and they ran me through the workaround using windows own logon until they resolve the incompatibility problem with the modem suppliers. So apart from that minor hiccup everything is fine, it is noticeably quicker than Win7 to load and my constant freezing problem seems to be resolved. I find the layout easy to adapt to after Win7 and no other problems found as yet. Even my very old Win95 Ulead Photo Express program works ok.
Cheers
Keith.

ricktas

14-08-2015, 2:54pm

LOL, yeah .. and has anyone found a way to remove that annoying ENG icon in the notification area?

Whilst that ENG is annoying, I did find one thing it is good for. If an App freezes, in the past you would go Ctrl+Alt+Del, open the task manager, find the app, and force close it. With the ENG, right click and there is a menu, and the task manager is right there.. much quickerer.

Oh and another good menu : Windows Key + X (key).

Warbler

14-08-2015, 4:09pm

Won't let me use the "Send File" option to email my invoices either. Have to go back to closing the PDFs and then attaching from within outlook instead. I think most of this might be because I won't spend money to update from Office Pro 2007 to Office Pro 2013 or whatever the latest version is.

arthurking83

14-08-2015, 5:17pm

re the ENG Rick. the right click is the entire taskbar. right click anywhere gives you the task manger. ps I used to have a quick access shortcut to it on the taskbar too anyhow .. and still do! :p

My main concern with this ENG tho is that I'm so used to the Engine Warning light on my car being on all the time, I see it now in WIn10 and thing it's engine is also about to die :D
(thanks to OBD tho I can turn it off as I please too ;))

Re Office, I'm still on Office 2010 and no problem(that I see). I don't use it much, and now with my change of lifestyle, I don't need Excel any longer for invoicing!

Hawthy

14-08-2015, 5:26pm

The upgrade to our laptop was seamless. The upgrade to our desktop finishes with a notification that states, "The Modern Set Up Host Stopped Working". I have worked through a number of suggestions, none of which have worked. Will let you know.

Just in case anyone else has this problem, I had to download the Windows 10 software to a DVD and run it from there. The set-up was about 99.99% complete when I received the same error message about the Modern Set Up Host stopping. I unplugged the computer and opened it up. (make sure that you hit the power button after unplugging the computer to discharge any remaining power). I removed the battery from the motherboard and replaced it after 20 seconds. Apparently this resets the BIOS.

When I re-started the computer, the set-up continued from where it had been and voila! Windows 10 was up and running.

I actually think that it is a great improvement on Windows 7. Smoother and faster.

ameerat42

14-08-2015, 5:29pm

Hawthy

14-08-2015, 5:48pm

Does anybody use Open Office? Some years ago someone sent me a .docx file. I could not open it with my
ancient version of MS OFFice (2000). Well, a few minutes - OK, a bit longer - I had it open after an install
of OO. Have been using it ever since:D

Am(just wondering is all:cool:).

- - - Updated - - -

PS: The MAJOR drawback is that the spreadsheet does not let me NOT use the $ symbol in a currency cell :(:(:(

I haven't but after having a look at it online, I would certainly consider it. My work had some deal with Microsoft where employees could get the latest full MS Office suite on CD for $10. That was pretty hard to pass up.

ameerat42

14-08-2015, 6:06pm

Of course, the MAJOR PLUS is that it's FR:D:D

Speedway

14-08-2015, 6:46pm

I'm still using office XP with with reader updates, no problems.
Cheers
Keith.

ameerat42

14-08-2015, 7:03pm

PS: You're right, Hawthy. I am talking about when you have no such deal. I wouldn't sneeze at that offer.
- Besides, it could be unhygenic:eek::D

- - - Updated - - -

PPS: Keith. So am I on one machine, Win 7 Starter (don't ask!) on another, and Win 8.1 here.:D

arthurking83

14-08-2015, 10:09pm

Does anybody use Open Office?.....

Yeah, on the whole I tend to.

With .docs in OO,

it can open .docx files, but cant' save them.

Only saves in .doc format which is supported up to Office 2010.

What you can do tho is save in .odt format(I think open document text of something .. and most modern Office versions(at least 2010 and 2013 that i know) can open this format.

it may have an error if you try to open it, as I see with Office 2010, but ignore it and open anyway and you're good to go.

just so you know, if you save a .doc file, you should have options to save it in a particular Office version format too. eg. 2007, or 2000 or whatever.

.docx I think is 2010 format and beyond. it contains some XML embedding, hence the x at the end of the format extension. allows stuff like editing via M$s online office tools, which you may see as a feature when you go to your OneDrive account page.

Have never come across the $ symbol issue in Calc tho .. I'll have a peek too.

- - - Updated - - -

Just had a peek.

Open Office 4.1 currently and can easily place a $ symbol anywhere.
Maybe it's just the formatting of the cells you tried to add the symbol into(or the version of OO).

is your version of OO set for Au as the region?
I just formatted cells and the default option(for some strange reason) seems to be English UK.
So the default options for currency are GB Pounds. But even formatted as such I can still insert a $ symbol.

Warbler

15-08-2015, 8:49am

How long before we get pop-up advertising in all our software? It's started already.

119208

antony

15-08-2015, 7:44pm

I had a good play on Windows 10 today, I have to say that I am not that excited.
I don't see the big fuss of Start menu showing on both Desktop mode nor Tablet mode. I am happy with 8.1's 'tile' mode.
As for the Edge browser, where is the swipe feature????
The swipe feature on Internet Explorer (Windows 8.1) is a very handy feature, just one finger swiping and can go back to one page without tapping on the relative small 'back' icon. I use this feature often (when I am on Windows 8.1/Surface Pro 3). Another good reason I am not rushing to Windows 10 soon.
Drawing on webpage is fun, but not really that exciting to be honest. I could always take a screenshot then draw on OneNote...

Warbler

17-08-2015, 2:32pm

One positive is that chkdsk no longer uses every bit of RAM available, well at least not when running it from Powershell. Unfortunately I'm having to run it because Win 10 refuses to boot because of PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA sometimes followed by hwpolicy.sys, but most times not. When it does run, it's as fast as treacle uphill.

ameerat42

17-08-2015, 3:10pm

ameerat42 typed "Hmm!" for this useful post.

Warbler

17-08-2015, 3:51pm

ameerat42 typed "Hmm!" for this useful post.

You'll know what chkdsk.exe is when you start having odd errors AM and have to check all your discs for errors. Lost files may not be lost at all, just missing from the disc indexes. Bad sectors on discs aren't always fatal either, but you probably wouldn't put crucial data on a disc with bad sectors anyway, just to be safe.

The new version tells you how much longer you'll be waiting unlike the old version where sometimes it looked liked it had stopped running. Still, ten hours for a 2TB disc can try the patience a bit.

119276

ameerat42

17-08-2015, 4:06pm

Ta Warbs, I have known it well for the past 25 yrs or so. It was coincidental that I had to use it today to prepare
a non-empty folder for deletion that I could not do thru Windows. It had some corrupted files in it. I was pleased to see it all
worked just as well as it used to.:D Yes, I had to do a "/f".

tduell

17-08-2015, 4:42pm

Does anybody use Open Office?
Yes...have done for donkey's years, LibreOffice now, and cheap at half the price.

Cheers,
Terry

Warbler

17-08-2015, 4:54pm

I've found that the "/f" doesn't always pick up the errors AM. the "/r" option takes a helluva lot longer, but it fixes the errors that the "/f" option sometimes misses. The older version running under the commend prompt was prone to running out of space to repair MBT errors. I wonder how this version will go.

ameerat42

17-08-2015, 5:04pm

Yep. Reason not to was that this was the only problem on the drive - a fairly clean external. (And bcoz I'm lazy.)

Warbler

17-08-2015, 5:59pm

Well this answers my earlier question AM. Time to bin this one. It's been laying around for while nbow while I wait to see whether it's ok or not. Guess not.

119278

ameerat42

17-08-2015, 7:14pm

Can't delete anything at all for extra space??

arthurking83

17-08-2015, 7:17pm

You'll know what chkdsk.exe is when you start having odd errors AM and have to check all your discs for errors. .....

Actually! .. a very timely reminder Warb.

I've slowly been going through some of my archives doing massive amounts of tagging and checking of stuff.
I only just found yesterday about 8 corrupted NEF(Nikon raw files) that can't seem to be recovered.
The last time those files were accessed in any intricate manner, was about 2009(when they were captured and then edited), but have been moved and saved and archived a few times since then too(last access date was 2012).
But they are corrupted, and these 8 are in a middle sequence of a couple of hundred other raw files shot on the same trip. All the other files are fine and dandy!
So the only plausible explanation for those 8 dead files is a transfer/write/update glitch somewhere over the past 3 or so years .. or some corrupted bits on the physical HDD.

About to do a similar checkdisk scan on the drive to be sure, to be sure ...

Warbler

17-08-2015, 8:56pm

Can't delete anything at all for extra space??

No, I'll just format the thing. There's nothing on it that wasn't backed up.

ameerat42

19-08-2015, 9:10am

Something I was alerted to earlier today is this reported problem when using CF and SD cards!!! (http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-files/windows-10-corrupts-files-without-warning-on-sd-cf/e2913a4a-201c-4646-a1b2-661e47419b80?auth=1)
:eek:m.

- - - Updated - - -

Note it's from the MS Community.

Warbler

19-08-2015, 9:40am

Something I was alerted to earlier today is this reported problem when using CF and SD cards!!! (http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-files/windows-10-corrupts-files-without-warning-on-sd-cf/e2913a4a-201c-4646-a1b2-661e47419b80?auth=1)
:eek:m.

Funny you should mention that. I deleted about 40 corrupt RAW files and JPEGs yesterday.

ameerat42

19-08-2015, 9:47am

Suddenly my foot has pressed the brake pedal firmly. I had it on "croose-control" before, set at Win 10:eek::eek:

Warbler

19-08-2015, 9:50am

And now my Lexar USB 3 Card Reader is not recognised at all. Of course it is not even showing a light now despite plugging it into a couple of different ports using a couple of different cables. No good! I'll plug the camera in to download these client photos I took this morning.

Works on the laptop which is also Win 10.

ameerat42

19-08-2015, 9:56am

I would have clicked "Thank for this useful post" but it was alarming and there was an inappropriate :2biggr: next to it.
Whatta rear-ender this is shaping up to be!:nod:

- - - Updated - - -

PS: If you put the card back in the camera can you do a playback of the "corrupt" images? Maybe it's (only) a glitch.

Warbler

19-08-2015, 10:12am

I don't know which card the corrupt images were from. There were 5,000 images on four cards. Explains why the bloody download took twelve hours though. I think I'll go back to Win 7 Ultimate on the desktop, but not today.

Warbler

19-08-2015, 3:20pm

Couldn't wait any longer! Back on Win 7 and loving it. That Lexar Card Reader works fine again. No BSOD or boot-up loops! Good riddance Win 10.

ameerat42

19-08-2015, 3:27pm

Hmm!:cool:

arthurking83

19-08-2015, 7:56pm

I think I said it in an earlier reply.
While it may well be Windows 10 at fault here, my suspicion is that it's most likely not!

There are so many devices in the chain from the CF card through to the final chip that translates the data onto the hard drives.

USB3 has known to be a problem on many windows installations, and while USB3 in geenral on Windows is well recognised, some chips in the USB3 chain are known to have issues.

I also have the Lexar USB3 CF/SD card reader and for most intents and purposes it works fine.
The other devices I had on USB3 are:

1. Patriot super fast USB3 64G flash drive.
2. USB3 generic hdd enclosure with my primary Seagate HDD photo backup storage device. 3T drive, 1.5Tb of images currently stored.
3. USB3 NexStar docking station.

All 3 USB3 devices have caused me grief at some point.
Under Win7 and a few issues in WIn10.

My biggest cause for concern was the docking station. Wouldn't transfer with a USB3 connection and most likely corrupted data after some time transferring data(I reckon).
It'd transfer some data and then stop. Connecting to USB2 I could transfer many hundreds of Gb's .. but it was painfully slow .. sometimes a whole day or so.
I got a USB3 docking station purely for the 'supposed' speed when transferring terabytes of data in a short time frame .. otherwise I'd have just bought a USB2 version for 1/4 the price.
After many months of uninstalling/reinstalling devices drivers USB3 drivers, trying other USB3 drivers, I finally found the reason why.
In the dockign station is a Serial to USB3 chip that converts from one interface type to the other(in this case from a SATA drive to a USB port.
It was this useless chip's embedded driver(the firmware) that was the problem all along. Searched many sources for firmware, and one indeed existed on the devices website.
Did what they said to do top update the firmware and no dice! .. same issue.
Looked for other solutions, and found some .. try installing other firmware even tho they weren't the actual ones for the device.
Some worked, but too slowly again(I know that this device can transfer at a sustained 125MB/s, but I'm getting more like USB2 speed again.
Finally found another new firmware on the chip makers website(over a year later) and installed this new one too and bingo! .. USB3 transfer speeds(@ 125MB/s) over the full 1.5Tb of data I needed to transfer.

The issue here wasn't Windows, nor really NexStar(docking station manufacturer) but it was the SATA to USB chip makers fault all this time. FWIW, this chip maker is ... my most despised manufacturer! :violent10: .. JMicron.
All they make are the internal chips that translate one interface to another.
Funnily, I began my hatred of their products even before this USB3 docking station issue, when I had a monumental effort to install the DVD reader/writer, which came from an ancient machine.
The IDE port used to connect the DVD comes courtesy of a chip on the motherboard that comes from none other than JMicron. That chip once again caused the issue in getting a device that is so basic in it's installation such as an IDE device such as a DVD drive.

The sooner companies like JMicron (who make the unseen and underlying hardware devices interfaces) stop infiltrating PCs with crap hardware .. I reckon the better windows will be in the long run.

The other thing I've had some troubles with again is the USB3 device chip maker.
I just happened to acquire an ASUS motherboard which happens to have a USB3 chip from a company called Renesas. It's an early version, and it has caused me no end of issue on an off.
The most recent has been occasional dropouts of the USB3 system. That is, devices would suddenly and unexpectedly uninstall and then immediately reinstall themselves as the USB3 subsystem would come off line and then immediately online again.
Renesas have been ok though as they updated drivers regularly for a while as issues became known .. and finally things all work fine now.
I only just discovered tho that I've had 8 corrupted raw files in my archive since about 2012.. the last time those files were accessed. This is in a series of about 200 or so images, but the other files are perfectly preserved.
I 'know' that this USB3 on/off issue caused this corruption at some point in the past.
Not too long after I finally had my Renesas USB3 driver issues sorted that I noticed that ASUS have switched their supplier of USB3 chips(and some other's that I've noted) from JMicron to Asmedia instead.(I wonder why ;)

My last USB3 issue, was my Patriot Xt USB thumb drive. Just didn't want to be seen one day, for no good reason. Unplugged it/plugged it numerous times, uninstalled USB3 drivers .. etc. and my initial thoughts as per usual is bloody Windows! :action:
But yet again .. and I SHOULD have known better(AGAIN!) .. it had nothing to do with windows, and everything to do with this particular model from Patriot. a quick search found me with a new firmware for this exact issue, downloaded run and fixed in about 30sec!

Moral of the story .. yeah! we all want our Windows machine to run like a swiss watch, and in general it probably actually does.
With hardware, it's almost certainly not a fault of Windows, but a driver or a firmware issue from the slack @$$ed manufacturer that can't be bothered to keep up with the issues they create.

Warbler

19-08-2015, 8:02pm

USB Card reader worked fine last week Arthur. Win 10 updated some files on the weekend, and it stopped working on the one machine and continued working on the other.

arthurking83

19-08-2015, 9:27pm

Without knowing what motherboards both those machines have, and hence what USB3 chipset, driver and firmware they use .. the issue isn't simply one of Windows stuffed up my card reader.
The question is with three to five other subsets involved in the total system .. something else is most likely the culprit.

I think of it this way.

Your laptop with Win10 works fine with the card reader(I'm assuming we both have the same CF/SD Lexar USB3 reader?) .. and so do my desktop and tablet.
So Windows 10 and Lexar card reader do work., as proved by 3 of our 4 computer systems.
Otherwise Lexar or M$ will likely release a new driver (or other fix) for an issue that would exist between those two systems.

My first port of call(when my brain is in gear, and I'm not instantly blaming Windows <X>) is to look at the other systems in the Lexar to Windows 10 chain (USB driver firmware/chipset) .. once I've exhausted those avenues .. then start blaming Windows again :D.

Somewhere in device manager you should be able to find out which USB3 chipset/driver your two PCs are using.
Isolate those differences and start looking into that side of things.

MissionMan

20-08-2015, 4:10pm

Been trying the Office 2016 preview and I would highly recommend avoiding it like the plague. It crashes more than a drunk on a unicycle

ameerat42

20-08-2015, 4:21pm

I've NEVVA seen a drunk ON a unicycle. One on the ground next to it a few times.

However, I will take you advice, MM, and stick to :Dpen Office

ameerat42

30-08-2015, 3:40pm

STOP PRESS!

Today it was my turn. I opted to do an upgrade of Win 8.1.
40 mins and it was over. So far so good. A couple of programs tested all
work as before. The Desktop looks the same as before, but only the Task Bar
icons look a bit too Lego-landish, but I suppose I'll get used to them, and they're
small anyway. Dunno about this Cortana thing. Haven't used it yet...

Am(pleased enough so far).

Cage

30-08-2015, 3:45pm

I'm now waiting till I get my NBN up and running.

Apparently W10 doesn't like Telstra's wireless modem.

Gazza

30-08-2015, 3:50pm

Waiting waiting waiting...

Been in the Q for about 10 days, not in any rush though....:D

Kym

30-08-2015, 3:56pm

Forced the upgrade if you don't want to wait ... https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows10/comments/3ezkrm/its_1201_eastern_time/

NB: If you want to do a clean install you MUST do the upgrade first and register that.
When you do a clean install over that MS will have already registered the hardware signature and you will be licensed.

Kym

30-08-2015, 3:57pm

How to make an install ISO image once you have upgraded http://www.zdnet.com/article/how-to-turn-your-windows-10-upgrade-into-an-iso/

Kym

30-08-2015, 4:00pm

Recommend a system disk cleanup before doing the upgrade;
also do a system fix via an Admin level CMD prompt using "sfc /scannow" see: http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/1538-sfc-scannow-command-system-file-checker.html

agb

31-08-2015, 9:11am

I did the upgrade, forced it as I was sick and tired of getting the failed to install message, and then decided to do a clean install on a different hard drive that I had available. Downloaded the media tool and burnt the ISO. Running fine with no problems. Nice and simple I think I even managed to get my i1display calibrator to operate despite GretagMacbeth not offering drivers for it.
I then bought a windows phone, running windows 8.1 phone, and much prefer it to the android that I was using.
Must be ill.

Cage

31-08-2015, 8:27pm

Yeah, I bit the bullet too.

Obviously some big problems with my W7, start-up has blown out to two minutes or more, and 1/2 an hour the other day.

Seemed to load seamlessly, few minor differences , the 'Refresh' doovey has moved but all in all it went OK.

Telstra emailed me that my Bigpond connection manager didn't work with W10, but I'm online so go figure.

teylward

01-09-2015, 2:39pm

I have just updated to Windows 10 from Windows 8.1.
I jumped in the queue while my laptop was cleared to take the windows 10 download.
Going off of my old school cable internet (Yes, I live 10mins out of Geelong and it's 2015, but somehow don't have decent internet on this side of the street)
The download started around 7pm and finished sometime during the morning, maybe around 1am or something.
The install was quick and all seemed well, until I tried using anything with sound.
It's made the subwoofer in the laptop get very bad distortion. I have searched it and apparently it's a pretty common issue. I have turned the subwoofer slider all the way down and it works OK now, but now I have no bass. I just did an update on the sound drivers, so will see how that goes.

ameerat42

01-09-2015, 2:41pm

Hope that's all. Mine's still OK. Another 3 machines.... eventually... to do.

teylward

01-09-2015, 2:46pm

Nice. Update on the last post.

Updated the drivers on the sound and all seems to be working properly with the subwoofer turned on.

I'm running realtek on an Asus. I've heard of Asus and Sony machine having the problem, not sure if that is all or not.

PS. Love the windows 10 look better than Windows 8.1. You can actually use the calculator with a screen in the background instead of the calculator taking up the whole screen

Cage

01-09-2015, 5:54pm

I don't have any sound at all.

Better look at updating the drivers.

Gazza

01-09-2015, 7:42pm

Upgrade done and dusted on both laptop and desktop. No complaints and a simple, smooth and painless transition/process - :D

ameerat42

01-09-2015, 8:06pm

I don't have any sound at all.

Better look at updating the drivers.

Kev. Whatttt?:D

Upgrade done and dusted on both laptop and desktop. No complaints and a simple, smooth and painless transition/process - :D

Gazza. Then you can stow the vacuum and the analgesics:nod::D

Cage

02-09-2015, 6:13pm

I don't have any sound at all.

Better look at updating the drivers.

Updated drivers, still no sound.

Googled the problem, it's not uncommon, all fixed now.

Ezookiel

02-09-2015, 8:27pm

It will be a very long time before I try W10 again.
The install stopped both Photoshop and Premiere Pro from working, and then wiped out my ability to download from websites. I could open pages, but couldn't download, so couldn't get updates, or new drivers, or even reinstall software that needed to get anything from the web.
It stopped Steam from working, so I couldn't work on either photos or videos, and nor could I then drown my sorrows by playing games.

Worse was to come - it wouldn't let me go back to Windows 8.1 because of the problems with connecting to download servers anywhere, and in the end my only option was to restore my MS Surface Pro 3 back to it's factory settings - the way it came from the box, and it killed a week of production and work. To say I was peeved was an understatement. Even their own tablet/laptop Surface doesn't work with their operating system. I'm still fuming over it.
I sure won't be going to try it again any time soon, even though others that lost connection to Steam have told me they have found solutions.

ameerat42

02-09-2015, 8:34pm

Hmm! I feel like a RIGHT CAD, Bounder, and Ne'er-do-well for NOT having a 1ngle problem with this, Zook.:o

Mark L

02-09-2015, 9:16pm

Glad you're all having fun. I'm stuck on Vista and the bank manager wants to go back to XP. Such a sad story.:(
How much fun it would be around here if I could update.:D:ps::)

cupic

06-10-2015, 6:17pm

With this gift from Microsoft :shh:
I was wondering that from Win7 Ultimate what is the equivalent version of Win 10?
And with this newer version is it a cracker of much to same ?

cheers

ameerat42

06-10-2015, 6:46pm

Good Q, Cupic. Google it and see (then tell us:D).

Moved your thread, BTW.
Am.

Leaping Lupo

06-10-2015, 7:54pm

Windows 10 Pro.

I have upgraded 2 out of 6 machines in the house to Win 10 so far. One was Win 7 Ultimate to Win 10 Pro upgrade. Post upgrade the machine seems to still have all the bells and whistles. This one is my 12 year son's laptop and was done at his request. With Win 10 Pro it plays all his media and retained all his existing software and he has not complained or struggled with the upgrade. The DVD player works. I have read that in some instances the Win 10 upgrade does not include a DVD/media capability which Microsoft then kindly (sic) provides again for a small fee. I don't believe this issue will occur upgrading from Win 7 Ultimate.

My wife and other son both see no need to give up Win 7 Ultimate, and have not upgraded. (neither machine having a touch screen).

The only other upgrade was from Win 8 Pro to Win 10 Pro on my Surface Pro 3. The jump from Win 8 is well worth it as Win 8 is awful. The upgrade was reasonably hassle free. I personally prefer Win 10 over any of the previous OS.

FYI ... I have not upgraded my work laptop (Lenovo Thinkpad X220T) from Wind 8 Pro to Win 10 yet. I can not afford this to go down so am waiting a bit longer to see how stable the other 2 upgrades continue to be.

ameerat42

06-10-2015, 9:20pm

ricktas

07-10-2015, 6:56am

I have upgraded both my laptop and desktop to win 10 (neither are touchscreen) and both run faster, have less freezes, start up much quicker (the laptop must think it has an SSD in it). I would recommend upgraded to anyone considering it.

bricat

07-10-2015, 7:51am

Just buy an SSD if you want faster start up. They are cheap and worth it. I upgraded one computer for about 2 days and was chasing my tail to get things working as with W7. My theory is if it's not broken DON'T fix it. And I knew as soon as it was free alarm bells started ringing. PS I don't have touchscreen. cheers Brian

ameerat42

07-10-2015, 8:07am

Brian. I would say that most OSes aren't necessarily "broken" to require upgrade.

Two main points I made are that 1. Win 10 is currently free (with conditions), and 2. Eventually you will have to
pay to upgrade your then unsupported Win 7. Furthermore, an SSD if not properly configured will not give
optimal performance. Sure, there will be some difference in speed. And there are lots of SSDs out there with
varying performance. Lastly, you would need to be specific on alarm bells: tone, frequency, melody,... etc.

Kym

07-10-2015, 8:59am

Win 10 is worth it.
But! Start with a well maintained system; i.e. no viruses or useless software.

Recommend a system disk cleanup before doing the upgrade;
also do a system fix via an Admin level CMD prompt using "sfc /scannow" see: http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/1538-sfc-scannow-command-system-file-checker.html

Also make sure your Win7 is fully patched up to date.

ameerat42

10-10-2015, 8:26pm

HMM!!! Windows 10 is operating well, but...

unlike its recent predecessors, it LACKS CD/DVD burning facility.

On Win XP I used to great advantage a little program called "CDBurnerXP".
It's a rather humble name, but it has been revamped for everything up to and including Win 10.

So I just installed it again on my Win 10 machine. (After I had spent an hour or more trying to burn/searching/firing up and finally
using this same program on my Win XP machine!! What a saga! Just to burn 500MB of imagery!! (Oh, it worked! Ta to XP.)

Here is the link. (https://cdburnerxp.se/en/home)
Am.

Gazza

10-10-2015, 8:41pm

arthurking83

10-10-2015, 11:05pm

Just buy an SSD if you want faster start up. They are cheap and worth it. .....

Technically they're very expensive(still!)
Where a mechanical HDD will cost in the region of $60-ish per Terabyte .. an SSD will cost you the same $60 per 100 Gigabytes .. but not so much for a topline product either!
So the term 'cheap' is a relative term, and by comparison to a spinning drive, they are ~10x as expensive!

The other point to note is that a faster boot time is still a faster boot time .. so while you're installing a new SSD, then you may as well install Win10 on this SSD it'll still give a faster boot up time than Win7 will on the SSD :th3:

I'm currently a bit of a Win10 fan except for one small annoyance so far.
On my old desktop(made in 2009) with older USB3 hardware, my USB3 system has seen a bit of a dramatic slowdown in bandwidth compared to how fast it was with Win7.

I'm 99.99% sure that this is not a Windows/M$ fault tho, and I'm sure it's simply a (lack of) a proper driver update from the chip manufacturer(as it almost always is).
I had a hell of a time getting USB3 to work with Win7 way back when I first built this desktop, and again all due to a lack of a well constructed driver/firmware from the manufacturer.
Eventually, after both a firmware update for the USB3 chip and a few drivers, it finally gave me USB3 speed(s).

FWIW: the original USB3 chip was recognised as an NEC chip, but then somewhere along the line it changed to a Renesas chip .. possibly after the firmware update :confused013

MissionMan

10-10-2015, 11:06pm

I think Burning was missing from
Win 7 as well unless you bought the pro version.

I'd advise against installing Office 2016. It's more unstable than Zimbabwe's economy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

cupic

10-10-2015, 11:10pm

arthurking83

10-10-2015, 11:24pm

I am concern with the privacy of Win 10
and unless your turn off this feature by
agreeing to Win10 you also agree with them
accessing your email browsing etc
So with so many conditions almost 47 pages to read through
i will stick with my Win7

cheers

While it is alarming what the term privacy has now come to mean .. in this day and age of cloud based everything I doubt that anyone's personal lives are actually personal or private!
So even on Win7, I'm sure there are many government agencies that have already read all your emails, texts, blogs, written notes and thoughts ... as well as checked your browsing, financial transaction and photography related histories. :p

bricat

11-10-2015, 6:04am

I'm sure there are many government agencies that have already read all your emails, texts, blogs, written notes and thoughts ... as well as checked your browsing, financial transaction and photography related histories.

:crike::hb::violent10::angel7:

ameerat42

11-10-2015, 8:59am

Ta Guys.
Gazza. I tried drag-and-drop. THAT "worked", but the files went nowhere and certainly not onto the disc:(

Will look at that option, though.

Gazza

11-10-2015, 9:33am

Ta Guys.
Gazza. I tried drag-and-drop. THAT "worked", but the files went nowhere and certainly not onto the disc:(

Will look at that option, though.
So outta curiosity I thought I'd give it a try :D...

Selected (Highlighted) the files I wanted, clicked Share → Burn to Disc (I had an old CD in the drive...don't think that would make any difference?) and off it went...there were a few options along the way....now I have a CD full of useless Smiley gif's :D Might give it to the grand-kids for their birthday....:D :D

ameerat42

11-10-2015, 9:40am

Tar again. Really!! And all the hoo-haa I read about there not being an option!!??
Will give this a go necks time. I gathered that it more more "authoring" (excuse atrocious Am spelling) it lacked.
?? knows??

- - - Updated - - -

Oh, PS: At some stage I got a burn to disc option (right-click I fink) but 0-thing happened.
Wonder if it could be a prob with the external burner???

- - - Updated - - -

PPS: I did it using the internal burner on the desktop (that runs XP).

MissionMan

11-10-2015, 2:43pm

More concerning with windows 10 is the default setting to essentially torrent updates from all users, particularly if you have limited bandwidth or on a mobile connection.

We had this "not so minor" issue with all our consultants blowing data caps on their 4G wifi modems and not understanding why they were leaking data. Microsoft has turned on a setting by default which uses your machine to torrent updates to other machines in the world and they turned it on by default. From what I understand, it's switched off for mobile connections but most Wifi 4G modems don't register as mobile devices. While I appreciate that this optimises the rollout of updates, why Microsoft chose to switch this on by default is a mystery. I have no doubt that many people are going to be blowing through data without realising it. You can find the setting in Windows Updates - Advanced Options - Choose How updates are delivered. I suggest you switch it off if you have limited bandwidth or use a wifi 4G modem regularly.

https://atholhill.smugmug.com/Family/Mixed/i-Z9J3j4z/0/XL/AAEAAQAAAAAAAAYCAAAAJDBlYTVhMjliLTM3ZGMtNDlmYS1hNjk2LWJlYmFhZmRkOWU5MQ-XL.png

ameerat42

11-10-2015, 4:27pm

Absolutely stupefactory!

It - and a swathe of ovver stuff - just went OFF-FF!

Ta for that MM.

ameerat42

26-10-2015, 9:34pm

Something I just found out - the hard way...

If you are running Asus Life Frame, a capture program for any ASUS product with a webcam, you will have to
run it in Win 8 Compatibility Mode in Win 10. (Or, presumably, Win 7 if you upgraded from that.)
Am(glad to have fixed it:rolleyes:).

MissionMan

28-10-2015, 1:58pm

Windows 10 has convinced me to upgrade my Macbook Air to a Macbook Pro 15 and dump my Surface Pro 3.

ameerat42

28-10-2015, 2:50pm

MM. Is that :), or :( ?

MissionMan

28-10-2015, 2:56pm

Windows 10 was a reminder of why I left Windows originally. 10 looked nice but it's still the same old MS. Lack of quality control on a broad scale. If MS can't get it right on their own hardware (we use SP3's), the chances of getting it right on someone else's hardware is pretty low. Using MS reminds me of getting together with an ex-girlfriend who has had plastic surgery and looks prettier, but when you spend some time with them, you realise it's still the same old psychotic ex and there was a good reason you left them.

ameerat42

28-10-2015, 3:02pm

OK, I'll take that as a "No", then:D

Warbler

28-10-2015, 6:47pm

I got a message telling me 100 million had availed themselves of the free upgrade. I think that is more like 100 million Beta-testers.... I'll wait till something better comes along thanks.

ameerat42

28-10-2015, 7:00pm

I got a message telling me 100 million had availed themselves of the free upgrade. I think that is more like 100 million Beta-testers.... I'll wait till something better comes along thanks.

Gee! I feel left out of this INclusive club. - I switched OFF my feedback and like options.
And Warbs, how are you going to know if it's "better"? From a beta-tester? :D:D

Warbler

28-10-2015, 7:22pm

Yep, after the 100 million have ironed out the problems, I might give it another go.

MissionMan

28-10-2015, 7:28pm

Yep, after the 100 million have ironed out the problems, I might give it another go.

Or you could get a Mac and have that experience from day 1 :p

I @ M

28-10-2015, 8:38pm

I guess I must be headed towards buying a 35mm film camera cos I just bought an OEM Win 7 the other day to go into a new PC. :D

JDuding

29-10-2015, 10:50am

Haven't read all this thread... but wanted to say...

Took me 2 days to switch off all the "helpful" invasion of privacy options and get the system to a state where I could use it comfortably online or near other networks and equipment.

In days to follow... found a bunch of other issues that needed the settings adjusted.
And now that it is running streamlined and not communicating to anyone without my consent... running fine.

Still wouldn't go back to Apple.
When it comes to invading privacy... win10 is still the apprentice. (based on when I was running MacOS 10... not up to date with their latest)

bitsnpieces

29-10-2015, 11:12am

Well, as a Windows user and never having used a Mac (other than when using someone else's computer), Windows 10 is definitely the best operating system so far, amidst its problems, as I enjoy the UI a little more, the functionality, etc.

Of course, there will be those who will say Windows 7 is better, I feel that the reasons for such are mainly based on peformance - Windows 10 isn't too bad.

Of course, they'll also say that it's just a matter of getting used to the Mac interface - I don't agree. But that's just me

Kym

29-10-2015, 11:40am

Windows 10 is definitely the best operating system so far,

Best Microsoft OS so far. If you are a i-Fan then MacOS, albeit Apple are dumbing it down too much.

Linux is brilliant but only if you know what you are doing.

MissionMan

29-10-2015, 12:42pm

Of course, they'll also say that it's just a matter of getting used to the Mac interface - I don't agree. But that's just me

Getting used to OSX (or any OS) takes at least a couple of weeks because you still work in the context of how you understand the previous way of working.

For example, in Windows, if you want to send a file to someone you right click and select File - Send to. It frustrated me that OSX didn't have this functionality until someone told me I could just drag the file to the Mail or Outlook icon on the dock and it would open an email with the file attached. Same functionality, different way of doing it but because you are thinking of how Windows works while using OSX, you think OSX is worse. You have to unlearn that and it takes a couple of weeks to understand that the Windows way isn't necessarily a better way, it's just a different way.

bitsnpieces

30-10-2015, 2:55am

But you can also drag files into docked icons to have them activated too? Even if the functionality isn't exactly the same as OSX (and I haven't used Window's method to its fullest to see what it can do), it's still there, plus so much more in general. Generally speaking, I can agree that Apple does have some great systems, Windows is just more user friendly. :)

ricktas

30-10-2015, 6:43am

Getting used to OSX (or any OS) takes at least a couple of weeks because you still work in the context of how you understand the previous way of working.

For example, in Windows, if you want to send a file to someone you right click and select File - Send to. It frustrated me that OSX didn't have this functionality until someone told me I could just drag the file to the Mail or Outlook icon on the dock and it would open an email with the file attached. Same functionality, different way of doing it but because you are thinking of how Windows works while using OSX, you think OSX is worse. You have to unlearn that and it takes a couple of weeks to understand that the Windows way isn't necessarily a better way, it's just a different way.

Agree. My new workplace has a mix of Apple and PC, and it is now 8 weeks in and I still have trouble remembering how Apple does it. Simple things like clicking on an item, then hitting the delete button...does nothing on the Mac. To me it seems it is (as you said) more about drag-n-drop functionality, than keyboard or mouse clicks. There is good and bad to both, but for me, familiarity around M$ and Windoze, and how to fix things (read friends and family who manage to 'break' their computers), I still prefer Windoze cause I can delve into the OS, or pull the unit apart and do repairs. I really do not like the closed off aspects of Mac. Takes me all of 5 mins to swap out and upgrade memory in a PC or laptop, yet on a Mac you have to take it to an Apple tech (as far as I can tell).

I am still finding Win 10 very stable, have not found anything that does not work, or want to play, with the new OS.

Cage

30-10-2015, 12:55pm

MissionMan

30-10-2015, 1:22pm

My W10 Pro upgrade has also being running without any major gliches for about 7 weeks.

Likes: The fact that it was a reasonably painless learning curve in the changeover from W7 Pro and all my soft/hardware seems to be running as previously.

Hates: - MS have removed the ability to be only notified of Updates and instead install them automatically meaning that they can pretty much get into your OS whenever they wish.
- Spider Solitaire can now only be played online with an occasional pop-up to buy something :angry0:

Mine was initially painless but ended up very painful. 2 reinstalls later, having to reindex multiple times and having Office being less stable than Zimbabwe's economy didn't help. The primary purpose for using it was the OneNote stylus integration and that is intermittent at best in Office 2016. It misses random keystrokes.

What worries me is that this was on MS's own hardware so if they can't be bothered to QA their own hardware properly, what likelihood do other suppliers have. It seems like a lucky packet where my Mac upgrades have been flawless to date. The new Surface Book and SP4 have also been plagued by issues so it seems they have a lot to learn for hardware that is more expensive than Apple. The Surface Book sells for $1000 more than the top of the range Macbook Pro 15" which has a quad core.

My solution now is to run Windows virtualised when I need it for business.

I wrote a Dear John letter to Microsoft. It wasn't pretty.

antony

30-10-2015, 1:57pm

Simple things like clicking on an item, then hitting the delete button...does nothing on the Mac.
Command (CMD) + Delete
is what you need.

I @ M

30-10-2015, 2:27pm

This thread has been a very interesting read thanks to all the contributors.

Now, a quick question. Does anyone know how to get rid of the annoying pop ups on 3 'puters telling us to get a free upgrade to win 10?

Going by the latest notification it would appear that 100 million lucky persons have availed themselves of the opportunity to grab the os for nix but it all reminds me of the maccas advertising a few decades ago where they proudly proclaimed that they had served over 50 million burgers ( or a figure along those lines ) and it wasn't long before posters were everywhere featuring the same graphics as the ad but with slightly altered text. It went along the lines of ---- over 50 million burgers served, 30 million eaten and 10 million digested. :D

I am sure that plenty of people need to keep up with technology and employ the latest operating systems, particularly those in business who rely on such stuff to keep the money rolling in. Then there would be those who like to have the latest ( and greatest ) tech at their disposal and have the luxury of being able to spend the time and their knowledge to get to know it inside out and are able to fix bugs they encounter during the process of learning the new software.

I am now quite happy to not even have attempted the huge download, especially on our 2 cans and a string 'net connection which would habve left me with no disk, a seemingly not quite right package that will undoubtedly require quite a few updates over the coming months to fix and most importantly I would probably have been left with my preferred editing software not operating.

Seeing as the editing machine was overdue for replacement and the desktop I use for everyday stuff suffered a PSU failure recently we had 2 machines built to bring us back to current day gear. Well, all went swimmingly with reinstalling the copy of win 7 pro and all associated software on the editing machine and because the everyday pc was a 32 bit machine running 7 home I bought another 7 pro disk to run on that.
Now we have the 3 desktops in the house all running the same system, negligible downtime and no software compatibility issues which of course lends itself to a stress free life. :)

Win 10? Yep, I might be ready for it in around 5 years. :D

JDuding

30-10-2015, 2:36pm

...MS have removed the ability to be only notified of Updates and instead install them automatically meaning that they can pretty much get into your OS whenever they wish...

Read your comment and had to go check my setup. I'd forgotten to turn the update service off.
So thanks for the heads up.

What I did was disable the Windows Update service completely.
This means that I will need to re-enable it if I ever want to update my system... but I can live with that.

I'm currently checking out what other services I can safely disable, without causing system instability.

I am disappointed with the new (second hand) desktop system I've just bought.
My laptop was struggling with RAW image editing... so I had a local computer shop make me a system that would cope better.
Found that the laptop was 9x quicker than this desktop that they built. Fully spewin.
Took it back and they put in an i7 processor (free) and 16GB of 1600 RAM (expensive).
Now my old slow laptop is only 4x quicker than the desktop.

I'm starting to think that it might be Win 10 that is slower than win 8?
or the graphics card (1GB 650Mhz).

Will see if I can get a speed improvement from disabling unnecessary services first.

- - - Updated - - -

...Does anyone know how to get rid of the annoying pop ups on 3 'puters telling us to get a free upgrade to win 10? ...
...Win 10? Yep, I might be ready for it in around 5 years. :D

I did a quick search and one of the Windows updates might have installed the Windows 10 marketing task bar app.

There looks to be a few ways to disable it... but i haven't done it... so could only recommend googling and checking out the best solution for you.

MissionMan

30-10-2015, 2:41pm

Does anyone know how to get rid of the annoying pop ups on 3 'puters telling us to get a free upgrade to win 10?

http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/get-rid-windows-10-upgrade-notification-windows-7-8/

Read your comment and had to go check my setup. I'd forgotten to turn the update service off.
So thanks for the heads up.

What I did was disable the Windows Update service completely.
This means that I will need to re-enable it if I ever want to update my system... but I can live with that.

I'm currently checking out what other services I can safely disable, without causing system instability.

I am disappointed with the new (second hand) desktop system I've just bought.
My laptop was struggling with RAW image editing... so I had a local computer shop make me a system that would cope better.
Found that the laptop was 9x quicker than this desktop that they built. Fully spewin.
Took it back and they put in an i7 processor (free) and 16GB of 1600 RAM (expensive).
Now my old slow laptop is only 4x quicker than the desktop.

I'm starting to think that it might be Win 10 that is slower than win 8?
or the graphics card (1GB 650Mhz).

Will see if I can get a speed improvement from disabling unnecessary services first.

Did your laptop not have solid state as a drive? that would make a massive difference. Solid state is typically 5-10x faster than normal hard drives. A normal hard drive runs at about 80MB per second. A SATA 3 hard drive (older style) runs at 600MB per second. A PCIE hard drive found in the newer laptops like the Surface Book or Macbook Pro 15 has 4 channels of PCIE 3.0 and can read at 2GB per second. To put that into perspective, if you open Adobe Photoshop which is a about 1GB, it takes 0.5-1 second for a solid state to load the application while a old style spindle drive will take 10 seconds.

This may not seem relevant to RAW processing, but the write speed is also effected by the drive so an old style drive will take longer to write.

Graphics cards can make a difference though so without comparing the specs or models of your old vs new machine, it's difficult to know where the problem is.

Cage

30-10-2015, 3:00pm

I am disappointed with the new (second hand) desktop system I've just bought.
My laptop was struggling with RAW image editing... so I had a local computer shop make me a system that would cope better.
Found that the laptop was 9x quicker than this desktop that they built. Fully spewin.
Took it back and they put in an i7 processor (free) and 16GB of 1600 RAM (expensive).
Now my old slow laptop is only 4x quicker than the desktop.

I'm starting to think that it might be Win 10 that is slower than win 8?
or the graphics card (1GB 650Mhz).

I build my own computers from scratch and thus avoid the crap that the friendly local computer shop unloads on you.

Do you have a full run down on the specs on your 'new' computer including model nos on all the hardware?
There could be incompatible parts or maybe just tired parts. If not, download CPU-Z which will give you most of the specs.

I'm sure someone here can have a look and point you in the right direction.

ameerat42

30-10-2015, 3:06pm

There are droves of I7 processors. Do a check of your model and see how it rates at the MS site (somewhere--I've forgotten where).
Nor are all SSDs as flash as their memory type implies. They could have made/sold you a bucket of bolts:eek: And speaking for two types of
external "spindle" type drives, the WD 1TB Passport and the Toshiba Canvio 1TB (equivalent) both USB3, both read/write as fast as my laptop's SSDs,
ie, quite well, thank you very much. I get about 100MBytes/sec. (Did you read bytes?).

JDuding

30-10-2015, 3:11pm

The laptop is an AMD (HP)... the desktop is intel.

The desktop has the C drive as a SSD and the E drive (HDD) for storing files.
I did see some speed improvement when I used the RAW file from the C drive... about 20% faster.

I don't think the laptop has a SSD... but would have to check to be sure.
Just looked up the graphics card for the laptop... this could be it.
AMD Radeon HD 7640G + HD 7670M Dual Graphics. 655/600Mhz.

Still would have hoped for more from the desktop.

I was going to start a thread about it yesterday... but was fuming and couldn't type a coherent rant, let alone a constructive comment.

Feeling a bit better today.

ameerat42

30-10-2015, 3:14pm

PS on an unrelated matter to your problem: I got 2GB RAM for $20 today to replace the modest 1GB stick in my
little old EEE netbook which runs an Atom processor. It can't take any more RAM as there's only 1 slot and it's DDR2:(

Next stop: Win 10 for this netbook:D:D At present it has Win 7 Starter.:o

- - - Updated - - -

Give that desktop to a relative for browsing the net and.... (you know what I'm going to say:D - but seriously:nod:)

- - - Updated - - -

Oh, and I don't think it's that graphics card.

JDuding

30-10-2015, 3:15pm

Thanks for the input @all... I will start a separate thread regarding my wise'less Desktop purchase... so not to derail this Win 10 thread too much :D

ameerat42

30-10-2015, 5:10pm

OK, since you have started the other thread, here's a WIN 10 experience for this one.

Once upon an operating system there was something called a "Windows Experience Indicator".
It came out in Win Vista, lived through Win7, and got "buried" though it's not dead for Win 8 and now Win 10.

Basically it lets you see the "performance" of the computer subsystems.

Win 7 cameo:
If you have Win 7 and DON'T know about it, try it out by...
1. Right-click "Computer" icon.
2. Click "Properties".
3. Look for the section headed "System" and then "Rating"
4. Note the rating number shown, and then do another test by clicking on the hyperlink labelled "Windows Experience Index"
5. Gloat, or otherwise, over your results.

Now for (apparently Win 8.x and certainly) Win 10 you can't do it with this easy method.
You either do it from the DOS command line (and a host of other truck-driving manoeuvres), or you install
a 3rd party program to replicate what WIn 7 had. That program is called "ChrisPC Win Experience Indicator".
You can find it here, (http://win-experience-index.chris-pc.com/how-to-check-windows-experience-index-in-windows-10.html) and it is free.

It will install on an external drive, and when you check out the T&Cs you can accept the first lot and decline (as I did because it gathered info) the 2nd lot.

AND ANOTHER THING: I do NOT succumb to any inducements to boost performance by installing anything else as they recommend.

Am.

arthurking83

31-10-2015, 4:56am

......

The desktop has the C drive as a SSD and the E drive (HDD) for storing files.
I did see some speed improvement when I used the RAW file from the C drive... about 20% faster.

......

For the quoted speed difference, is that for all computer related stuff, or mainly for photo editing speed issues.

Like MissionMan said, HDD's play an important role for some things, but not so much for other stuff.

If your speed difference reference is (say) for gaming ... then obviously the graphics card will make a difference.
But for photo editing, the graphics card make little difference.
Where you can eke out some extra speed in raw/tiff editing is in having a fast HDD, a large cache(for the software to use) .. you already have more than enough RAM.
The HDD on your desktop .. what model is it.
While MM mentioned that a HDD can run at 80Mb/s, and I tend to favour the 100-120MB/s models!! .. :th3: .. you should note that some of the cheaper(and greener) HDDs can really only run at 50MB/s or less. I have WD 'Green' model it it's speed simply sucks!(there's no other word for it other than crapola!)
It's top speed is about 35-40MB/s.
Place any raw files(or large tiff files) on it and and watch it slow down every raw software like molasses .. in winter! Unbearable stuff.
But the difference in operating speed when those files are served from the 120MB/s Seagate drive is incredible to watch.

I don't do gaming .. so can't help if that is an issue for 'ya.

JDuding

31-10-2015, 5:15am

For the quoted speed difference, is that for all computer related stuff, or mainly for photo editing speed issues.

Like MissionMan said, HDD's play an important role for some things, but not so much for other stuff.

If your speed difference reference is (say) for gaming ... then obviously the graphics card will make a difference.
But for photo editing, the graphics card make little difference.
Where you can eke out some extra speed in raw/tiff editing is in having a fast HDD, a large cache(for the software to use) .. you already have more than enough RAM.
The HDD on your desktop .. what model is it.
While MM mentioned that a HDD can run at 80Mb/s, and I tend to favour the 100-120MB/s models!! .. :th3: .. you should note that some of the cheaper(and greener) HDDs can really only run at 50MB/s or less. I have WD 'Green' model it it's speed simply sucks!(there's no other word for it other than crapola!)
It's top speed is about 35-40MB/s.
Place any raw files(or large tiff files) on it and and watch it slow down every raw software like molasses .. in winter! Unbearable stuff.
But the difference in operating speed when those files are served from the 120MB/s Seagate drive is incredible to watch.

I don't do gaming .. so can't help if that is an issue for 'ya.

Hi Arthur,

This desktop will be a dedicated photo and video editing machine.

I have two storage devices installed.
One is a 1TB HDD and used only for storing the image files.
The other is an SSD (solid state drive) (like an over sized USB memory stick).
This SSD has Win10 and the software installed on it.
I did see nearly 30% improvement when I put the image file on it as well when testing.

The SSD runs pretty quick... no moving bits... I'm not sure what brand I have installed... but a Kingston 120GB runs at read/write speeds of 497/166 MBps... so I have ruled the drive out as being the bottleneck.

I will look to see if Win10 has the power setting for the CPU running at 100%. I didn't check earlier, as it isn't a laptop.

I'll check back in later... off to work.
Thanks everyone.

Tannin

31-10-2015, 7:14am

ameerat42

31-10-2015, 8:26am

Oh, well!

antony

31-10-2015, 8:51am

It's getting worse. Much worse: How Microsoft will cram Windows 10 even harder down your PC's throat early next year New OS will be 'recommended' automatic update http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/10/30/windows_10_updates/

Ouch.

I've been clicking that free upgrade to Windows 10 message popping up from time to time on my Surface Pro 3.

MissionMan

31-10-2015, 9:01am

I was worried for a little while and then I realised they can't force a Windows 10 on a Mac :p

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ameerat42

31-10-2015, 9:04am

I was worried for a little while and then I realised they can't force a Windows 10 on a Mac :p
...

C:(mmiserations, MM. :D

agb

31-10-2015, 9:14am

MissionMan

31-10-2015, 9:20am

I keep reading all the comments from those who don't want or like Windows 10 and keep wondering why. I upgraded mine and liked it so much that I decided to get a new hard drive and clean install since I had so much gunk on the old system, 8.1. I find 10 great.
And I love my windows phone too, much better experience for me than the android that I was using.
Off to see the psychiatrist in case there is something wrong with me.

I actually like Windows 10, especially compared to 8.1, the vast majority of my complaints are about Windows is the lack of quality control. It seems like every SP1 is what the software should have been and customers suffer at their expense.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ameerat42

31-10-2015, 9:45am

...Off to see the psychiatrist in case there is something wrong with me...

See you there:p:p

Tannin

31-10-2015, 12:19pm

I've been clicking that free upgrade to Windows 10 message popping up from time to time on my Surface Pro 3.

You might find this script useful. I've used it on about a dozen systems now; seems to work very well. https://voat.co/v/technology/comments/459263

antony

31-10-2015, 5:40pm

Thank you Tannin,

I will check it out.

ameerat42

01-11-2015, 8:07pm

HOOR.... (almost - AY!)

1. After nearly 4 hours, I got WIN 10 installed on my most humble EEEPC netbook.

It came with a Gig of RAM (It would barely bleat:o) and Win 7 Starter (<"Home").

The other day I expended the princely sum of $20 to upgrade it to its max capable
2 Gigs of RAM.

2. The story's not quite over, as I have to update a driver to make the touchpad work. But at least
the keyboard and mouse work.

ameerat42

02-11-2015, 2:09pm

Dribs and drabs updates on Win 10 experience...

Usually you can tell your resident virus check program to scan a single file, group of files, or a folder
just by doing a R-click on the items involved.

Well, you CAN'T in Win 10 :D - there's no R-click context menu item :eek::(

This long article (https://www.winhelp.us/windows-defender-on-demand-scan-in-windows-8.html) tells you something about it.

Hey, SuperAntiSpyware (http://www.superantispyware.com/), here I come!:nod: It at least adds a R-click context item:rolleyes:

--Oh, for the Netbook.

landyvlad

02-11-2015, 4:41pm

Win 10 on the desktop.

Overall impression good (from Win 7) BUT it does have a few issues, some of which have been fixed as updates released/installed.

Main one for me is Windows Media Centre is not supported at all and thus my TV tuner card that I recently bought is just taking up space.
I have managed to find a work around with NextPVR + Kodo but it's by no means an easy set up and I'm still troubleshooting it.

I've had no issues running PP software, all works as it should. So do games... not that I waste time on those... ;)

My big beef is that as MissionMan said, MS treats all of it's customers as "beta testers". It's just not acceptable.

I @ M

02-11-2015, 5:02pm

My big beef is that as MissionMan said, MS treats all of it's customers as "beta testers". It's just not acceptable.

Good job you the cameras that you do and not Nikon then or you would be doubly beta testing products and doubly peeved. :nod:

arthurking83

02-11-2015, 8:53pm

Good job you the cameras that you do and not Nikon then or you would be doubly beta testing products and doubly peeved. :nod:

:p

After however long it's been since Win10 appeared(I've had it from day 3) .. no real issues. One or two minor issues, but that happens any/every where.

But the strange thing is being a part of Nikon's beta testing process(unwittingly) .. with their silly CaptureNX-D software .. since Win10 I've had no real issues.
it's runs sort'a fast enough. I'ts yet to crash at all on Win10 .. where on Win7 it was the opposite where it rarely every ran without some cryptic and useless crash pop up info ... what the hell is 'appcrash' :rolleyes:

So in a way, I've seen more of an improvement in Windows since the update to 10(from 7).
No other issues in my other main software FF, CaptureNX2, ViewNX2, Excel(I never use any of the other Office stuff). PC boots at the same 'slowly' pace as it did on Win7. Login screen is faster, but time to ready to actually do something is effectively the same.
While it's appears to load onto the desktop quicker, behind the scenes Win10 is loading some processes or drivers under the guise of being ready to go, but you go to do some thing/process .. and it doesn't(until it's done doing it's stuff).

JDuding

03-11-2015, 10:57am

Currently working through a lot of advice re: my Win10 desktop pc....

A wise AP member (thanks Arthur ;)) suggested that one thing to check is the storage mode used. He also suggested that I not change anything. LOL... I listened... but ignored with the best of intentions :D.

Came across an issue after changing from 'IDE' mode to 'AHCI' mode.
A reboot and "INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE" error message.

Did a search online and found that this happens after a Win10 upgrade.
Found this solution posted...
http://www.tenforums.com/performance-maintenance/15006-attn-ssd-owners-enabling-ahci-mode-after-windows-10-installation.html

Will give it a go and see if the AHCI mode helps with my speed issues.
But thought I'd post in this thread to offer a link for any that may come across the same issue.

Will update my Desktop pc thread later with progress and results when I can.

Cage

03-11-2015, 11:20am

Did you get a mobo manual with the computer ?

If not, I'd suggest you download one ASAP, otherwise you are just stumbling around in the dark.

JDuding

03-11-2015, 11:49am

Did you get a mobo manual with the computer ?

If not, I'd suggest you download one ASAP, otherwise you are just stumbling around in the dark.

No... will hunt one down now.

Also to note... Changing the mode from IDE to AHCI seems to have sped things up another second quicker.

Cage

03-11-2015, 12:52pm

121226

Well how rude, how bloody arrogant and self important can you get. :angry0:

The self-appointed computer God, aka Microsoft, has decided that it is so powerful, and so much in control of your computer that it no longer needs to identify itself.

Well hello Microsoft, I like to think that in this age of hackers and scammers I can still exercise some control over who I invite to play with the inner workings of my computer.

W7, and most previous OS gave you the option of viewing available updates and choosing when, and if, to download them. This was particularly useful for me as I'd unknowingly bought a developers copy of Office which MS verified and subsequently froze on my system. It still offered Service Packs and Updates for the dud program, and as I was on a tight internet download plan I was able to refuse them.

The above pictured pop-up basically froze my computer till I either scheduled the download or restarted my computer. As I wasn't sure if it actually was from MS, as they didn't bother to identify themselves, I did a hard re-set and the hidden updates magically downloaded and installed themselves.

OK, I guess I can see where MS hope to go with W10. If they force everyone onto W10 they only have one OS to worry about and will have less problems if they force updates on those too lazy or uninformed to do the updates themselves.

To quote George Orwell's words from '1984'

In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.

Big Brother is watching you.

ameerat42

03-11-2015, 12:59pm

Did they have computers in "1984". I remember they had lots of TV screens everywhere.
Time you wrote the sequel, Kev...

1984 - 2
:D

Cage

03-11-2015, 2:20pm

Did they have computers in "1984". I remember they had lots of TV screens everywhere.

I bought my first computer, a Commodore Amiga, in the mid 80's.

It had no hard-drive, only a floppy drive, and 1MB of memory. I added another floppy drive and an extra 1MB of external plug-inn memory and it fairly flew, sorta. :lol:

Everything was done with floppys and I remember I had a game called 'Monkey Island' that as you moved through it you had to keep changing floppy discs.

I went really high tech in the late 80's and upgraded to a model with a 40MB hard drive. WooHoo :efelant:

Oh, and it used a windows type OS as opposed to the IBM machines of the day that were DOS command systems.

Ah, the good old days.

Kym

03-11-2015, 2:25pm

I bought my first computer, a Commodore Amiga, in the mid 80's. <snip>

Bah! Modern technology. This is where I started: http://www.farnik.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Retro_Computing

ameerat42

03-11-2015, 2:33pm

I knowwem well. Still got 2 - in the shed somewhere:o - and before that the C=64 and the C=128.
Top machines - in their day. Still got one and two, resp, of them. What a hoarder collector I am:rolleyes:

Yes, and do you remember when the C=64 - yes, even - had the Graphical "E" (can't remember the E meaning) Operating System?
It was called GEOS 64 ( I had GEOS 128). You could navigate with those clunky joysticks and "drag-and-drop" icons onto the
printer or Waste-bin icons... What you could do with 64 KB of RAM!!!

Ahh! You're right.

- - - Updated - - -

PS: A brief diversion for reminiscing:cool:

Ionica

03-11-2015, 2:34pm

I bought my first computer, a Commodore Amiga, in the mid 80's.

It had no hard-drive, only a floppy drive, and 1MB of memory. I added another floppy drive and an extra 1MB of external plug-inn memory and it fairly flew, sorta. :lol:

Everything was done with floppys and I remember I had a game called 'Monkey Island' that as you moved through it you had to keep changing floppy discs.

I went really high tech in the late 80's and upgraded to a model with a 40MB hard drive. WooHoo :efelant:

Oh, and it used a windows type OS as opposed to the IBM machines of the day that were DOS command systems.

Ah, the good old days.

I remember, when working at a TAFE College in Sydney in the early 1980's, the Science teachers being very excited with the Dept's new computer - a 40mb. hard drive AND word processor. :eek:

Warbler

03-11-2015, 2:51pm

I remember, when working at a TAFE College in Sydney in the early 1980's, the Science teachers being very excited with the Dept's new computer - a 40mb. hard drive AND word processor. :eek:

I bet the word processor was Word Perfect... I still remember one of my lecturers at Monash University telling me I had to learn Word Perfect because it had 80% of the market. I wanted to use Word for Windows and Excel. They made me use Lotus 1-2-3 too. I started using old XT computers and the original Apple McIntoshes. Thought I was king of the world when I got my first 386 with 4MB of RAM.

ameerat42

03-11-2015, 2:54pm

Bah! Modern technology. This is where I started: http://www.farnik.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Retro_Computing

Hmm! A bit "furver" back than me, Kym. I had Fortran 77 in the late 80s and then Various BASICs, although some of our interfaces were just printers.
We didn't always have a VDU (remember that?) - and weren't those swishly integrated with the computer and keyboard:eek:. [/a bearded ancient icon]

Cage

03-11-2015, 4:03pm

Bah! Modern technology. This is where I started: http://www.farnik.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Retro_Computing

My first exposure to computing was in the late 50's. I was a junior auditor and one of the clients used the card punch system for their sales summary.

I was working for the NRMA in the early sixties and was selected to do a computing aptitude test. I didn't pass, might be something to do with the fact I'd been away for the weekend as pit crew for a motor racing friend and arrived back in Sydney about two hours before the test, not completely sober. :oops:

When I bought the Commodore I'd seen a friends set-up and another friend said I should seriously have a look at his IBM. I rocked up to his place and was fronted by a blank screen with a blinking cursor. When I asked how it worked he handed me a bunch of typed foolscap sheets with about a zillion DOS commands. The Commodore was a no-brainer.

MissionMan

03-11-2015, 4:16pm

121226

Well how rude, how bloody arrogant and self important can you get. :angry0:

The self-appointed computer God, aka Microsoft, has decided that it is so powerful, and so much in control of your computer that it no longer needs to identify itself.

Well hello Microsoft, I like to think that in this age of hackers and scammers I can still exercise some control over who I invite to play with the inner workings of my computer.

W7, and most previous OS gave you the option of viewing available updates and choosing when, and if, to download them. This was particularly useful for me as I'd unknowingly bought a developers copy of Office which MS verified and subsequently froze on my system. It still offered Service Packs and Updates for the dud program, and as I was on a tight internet download plan I was able to refuse them.

The above pictured pop-up basically froze my computer till I either scheduled the download or restarted my computer. As I wasn't sure if it actually was from MS, as they didn't bother to identify themselves, I did a hard re-set and the hidden updates magically downloaded and installed themselves.

OK, I guess I can see where MS hope to go with W10. If they force everyone onto W10 they only have one OS to worry about and will have less problems if they force updates on those too lazy or uninformed to do the updates themselves.

To quote George Orwell's words from '1984'

Have you switched off the MS Torrent update that sends out updates from your machine to other users when you aren't using your connection?

Cage

03-11-2015, 4:23pm

Yes, I have, even though I have a stand alone set-up.

tduell

03-11-2015, 4:41pm

Bah! Modern technology. This is where I started: http://www.farnik.com/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Retro_Computing

A good start.
My first computing experience was with an Olivetti Programmer 101...there has been a very good TV program about it "The machine that changed the world" I think. That was the precursor to the PC. This was at SAIT.
At the same time we also used the big CDC 6400 (?) mainframe at Adelaide Uni.
Used Olivetti's own language on the 101 and Fortran IV on the CDC.
Later progressed to the BBC micro (Acorn) which had some pretty smart features, and a nice Basic language.
I recall Acorn invented Econet, a network system for the BBC micro, and one day they had a visitor from the USA (a Mr Gates) and were telling him about the network. It has been alleged that his big question was "what's a network?".
It's linux these days.

Cheers,
Terry

MissionMan

03-11-2015, 5:09pm

Yes, I have, even though I have a stand alone set-up.

It doesn't matter if you aren't on a network. If you read the wording they send out updates to other users on the internet as well. Dodgy as.

arthurking83

03-11-2015, 8:50pm

....

Did a search online and found that this happens after a Win10 upgrade.
Found this solution posted...
http://www.tenforums.com/performance-maintenance/15006-attn-ssd-owners-enabling-ahci-mode-after-windows-10-installation.html

Will give it a go and see if the AHCI mode helps with my speed issues.
.....

That inability to boot issue will happen on any operating system .. it's not a Win 10 issue.

In as few words as I can muster .. basically doing that(without doing the registry change first) borks your OS.
So the process is to first change the registry setting, and THEN change the mobo from IDE mode to AHCI mode .. all is then good(simply because of the reboot process order)

Anyhow .. looks like another reason to use Win10 instead of Win7.
Doing that(IDE mode change in Win7 stuff up your system, and a reinstall is about the best way forward from there. There are recovery options I think tho .. but it didn't work for me ;)

I'll try to do some performance testing for 'ya JD .. and see how much difference I get in CNX-D using a slow HDD and a faster HDD as the source location for the actual raw files.
(I'll post anything of value in your other thread tho).

ameerat42

04-12-2015, 11:29am

This was first mentioned in Post 215 of this thread.

Recap: Win 7 and Win Vista had a handy computer performance indicator built in. It was
accessed and displayed when you did a Right-click on the My Computer Icon.

They removed easy access to the feature in Win 8 and Win 10, but the performance calculator
is still there. You now access it in either of two ways - a manual and an easier graphical way.

Both these ways are described in this video here. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkiWWPXLhUI)

Ultimately (though a while back) I installed the "Chris" method, but I gave the manual method a whirl
this morning.

Added: The reason for this was to see how I could check the performance of laptops on display in stores without
having to install anything (obviously not allowed) on them.

- - - Updated - - -

PS: And mentioned somewhere else...

Don't forget to copy Clipboard.exe from Win XP and put it into the System32 folder of 8 or 10.
(And make a handy link to it on the Desktop.):D

Cage

04-12-2015, 4:39pm

Cheers Am.

I had forgotten about the WEI.

I try to minimise the extra software on my 'puter so I went the Command Prompt way.

Command Prompt: winsat formal -restart (yes, use the spaces)

Takes a minute or so, then go to File Explorer > Local Disc C: > Windows > Performance > Win Sat > DataStore > Formal Assessment

This is the result. I think mine has improved a tad since switching to W10.
122002

ameerat42

04-12-2015, 4:46pm

Yep. Have you tried ChrisPC?

Anyway, what sort of a rocket are you running!!??

Cage

04-12-2015, 6:34pm

Yep. Have you tried ChrisPC?

Anyway, what sort of a rocket are you running!!??

Nothing too flash.

- AMD Phenom II X4 955 CPU running standard @ 3.2GHz
- Samsung 840 Pro SSD
- ATI Radeon HD 5750 GPU
- 16GB G.SKILL Ripjaws RAM @ 1333MHz

I did have the CPU running at 4.0GHz and the RAM at 1600MHz but my prime BIOS spat the dummy and switched to the back-up BIOS. I intend to flash the original BIOS and re-do the settings, but as my system is chugging along well enough for my needs it's not a priority. If it 'aint broke, don't fix it hey.

PS: I did try the ChrisPC tool and it came up with exactly the same results as MS did.

ameerat42

25-03-2016, 7:49pm

Just an "upgrade":
Did the 6th upgrade to Win 10 today. - A friend's Core 2 Duo machine on Win 7.
Took 1hr 40m from Go to Whoa. Not too bad for slowish HDD. My SSD machine
still holds the record at 50 mins:D

Results: not a hitch. Even the face recognition login verification still worked. Only change
was that it did not flash the "camera on" light during operation.

MissionMan

25-03-2016, 8:46pm

ameerat42

25-03-2016, 9:19pm

MissionMan

25-03-2016, 9:28pm

For me it has been stable since this horse bolted. (http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?140953-MS-Windows-10-anybody&p=1312318#post1312318)
I don't know what, but I have not had a worse problem than one incompatible driver on the little ole Netbook (I mentioned elsewhere in this long thread). That took a few minutes to fix.
So that makes it... well, from last August, and as mentioned, the 6th one today. (Got another tomorrow:D)

We have a number of Surface Pro 3's and Surface Pro 4's. Stability was absolutely dismal from day one, so much so that we stopped buying them for our consultants. They have finally settled down and become less problematic in the last two weeks, but Microsoft's failure to even respond to our complaints (we received no response from Microsoft in 3 months despite asking them numerous times) resulted in us dumping the Microsoft hardware permanently.

Cage

25-03-2016, 10:51pm

I think I've learnt to live with W10, other than what I consider to be an attempt to take total control of my personal space by Microsoft. :(

arthurking83

26-03-2016, 4:58am

..... My SSD machine
still holds the record at 50 mins:D

.....

I got you beat there champ!
I'm slowly building a couple of barebones PCs for my sister over the next few weeks.
Did one the other day, and took about 3 hours to do the complete build .. AND have a booted up system.
I think the Win10 install itself only took a few minutes .... 15mins max!
Didn't time it properly, but it was during making dinner and I was surprised at how quick it all went.

Problem I had was in getting a cheap 'n' nasty case with PSU .. very cheap.
The cheapest case without PSU cost more than the cheap case with PSU! :confused013
But the PSU was useless(wrong type) .. didn't know this when I got it as there were no details .. and to get the system up and running I had to go back out and get another PSU.

The other issue with the cheap'n'nasty case was that the motherboard staunchions(keep the motherboard off the case chassis) were all useless and loose fitting on the chassis itself.
So to stop them from freely rotating I had to glue them down.

So considering the troubles I had with that one, I'd say the next PC to be built should take about an hour all up.

What surprised me is how quickly installing drivers has been.
PC takes about 15 sec to reboot, and any installs(drivers, software etc) are super quick.

I'm getting her to try(trial) as much free/open software as possible, so I installed Thunderbird and OO instead of M$ Office.

ps. it was actually Office that prompted the quick build too.
We've been planning all this for a while, and had both a budget in mind and a timeframe to do it all.
As the PC's are for a business, and one of them is absolutely critical in terms of usage and stability, gave myself a long time frame and changeover period to do it, but the other day she got a virus(actually ransomware) on the Office PC that killed all of her office files(xls's and doc's) and encrypted them.
Luckily she had a backup of a few critical files, but many old files got locked, and we thought easier to dump the PC than to try to clean it out .. so new PC was built for her to use in the office first.

My only problem with having done this now, is that it's put me under pressure to build myself a new PC too ..... so envious of how much quicker it was than mine.

ameerat42

26-03-2016, 8:53am

15 mins, eh!:(
For sure OO, but I passed on T'bird.
AFA names go, "Firefox" is about the limit of incongruity for me.:D

Cage

26-03-2016, 9:42am

@ Arthur,

If there's one thing I've learnt from fifteen years of building my own computers, it is not to skimp on the PSU. :nod:

PS: And even though I've learnt to live with W10, I'm still a long way from loving it.

ameerat42

26-03-2016, 12:22pm

Upgrade #7 today. A Tsh Notebook, Core I5 2.5GHz, and
hITCHless, but for the 2.5 hours it took.:D

Lance B

26-03-2016, 4:20pm

My computer upgraded by itself today!! :eek:

I dread to say it, but so far so good.

ameerat42

26-03-2016, 4:28pm

My computer upgraded by itself today!! :eek:

I dread to say it, but so far so good.

C:(mmiserations, Lance - that the expected dreads have not yet arrived:D

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it will probably ALL be alright:nod:

arthurking83

28-03-2016, 5:42am

@ Arthur,

If there's one thing I've learnt from fifteen years of building my own computers, it is not to skimp on the PSU. :nod:

....

As with anything really.

For last personal build, I did exactly that.
Skimped a little on the case and PSU, and put the extra money(considerable too) in more RAM and HDD's

The case I did get(as opposed to would have preferred to have got) was a non name brand called Aerocool. Very cheap combo(about $30-40 if I remember right).
I usually prefer Antec's stuff .. very nice cases and quality PSU's .. but that was over $150 more in total price ... I preferred to put that money into more RAM and HDD ;)

Anyhow, the case was the worst I've had to put together, in terms of actually placing HDDs into their so called slots.
I'd like to say that whoever designed it must have been blind drunk or something. But it obviously wasn't designed at all, and looks to be more 'randomly cobbled' together rather than 'designed'.

Next time back to Antec for sure as I love the way they design their products.

But the $40ish case and PSU I had to limit myself too .. the PSU is still going fine after so many years. The fan makes a noise for a few short seconds, has been for a while now.
But it then shuts itself up and then just purrs along.
That PC came into existence back in '09 .. so it's done pretty well .. especially considering the power hungry needs of an AMD CPU!

Barney

28-03-2016, 9:34am

Also running it on my Surface Pro 3. Working very well. A massive improvement on Windows 8 which was dismal.

Going by the tsunami of annoyance Windows 8 causes , I think MS-DOS would be an improvement :laughing1:

Cage

28-03-2016, 9:49am

Next time back to Antec for sure as I love the way they design their products.

That PC came into existence back in '09 .. so it's done pretty well .. especially considering the power hungry needs of an AMD CPU!

My last two builds have been in Antec cases, the most recent with some flash blue LED lighting around the front fans. :cool:

And if my memory serves me correctly you are also using the AMD Phenom II X4 955 BE, which I had happily chugging away at 4.0MHz without a hiccup, till my BIOS shat itself and switched to the alternate BIOS that Gigabyte thoughtfully provided. After ten years using Asus mobos I switched to Gigabyte and couldn't be happier.

And that reminds me that I have to flash the corrupted BIOS, a task that I always approach with more than a little dread and trepidation. :(

Lance B

28-03-2016, 8:17pm

Spoke too soon. My output files from Capture One Pro 9 are corrupted somehow and I get all sorts of strange looking files when i try to open them up in Adobe Bridge and then in Photoshop. :(

I have uninstalled and re-installed Capture One Pro 9 and uninstalled- and re-installed Adobe Bridge and Photoshop, still the same. Sigh. Why can't these things just work as advertised. :(

ameerat42

28-03-2016, 8:18pm

Coubbe a different issue than Win 10. Have you tracked it down to anything in particular?

Lance B

28-03-2016, 8:20pm

Coubbe a different issue than Win 10. Have you tracked it down to anything in particular?

I have tried saving to a different hard drive and as I stated in my re-edited post above I have uninstalled and re-installed Capture One Pro 9 and uninstalled- and re-installed Adobe Bridge and Photoshop, still the same.

Lance B

29-03-2016, 8:41am

It was a setting in Capture One that needed to be altered, why I don't know as I have never touched this setting previously on any of the COP versions and it wasn't altered prior to WIndows 10 upgrade. I posted a request for help on the Capture One forum and a forum member suggested I try altering this setting and it worked. I had to alter "Hardware Acceleration (OpenCL for)" from "Auto" to "Never", why I have no idea. Anyway, all seems good now. :)

arthurking83

29-03-2016, 9:16pm

.... I had to alter "Hardware Acceleration (OpenCL for)" from "Auto" to "Never", why I have no idea. Anyway, all seems good now. :)

A strange anomaly with C1P, maybe.

I've loaded a few image editing/viewing programs on W10, including but not limited to CaptureNX2, ViewNX2, Lr 4(something), FSViewer and even Windows Photo Galley .. all holdovers from the W7 to W10 upgrade .. and no settings issues there.

As I upgraded from W7 to W10, I thought I'd try the Photoshop trial again for a month .. just to see if it'd give me that month again(already used up on W7) ..and it worked.
All worked good, albeit slowly via ACR and Bridge again .. no problems(other than long wait times).

I'd say, as it's an Open CL/hardware acceleration related issue, then it probably had more to do with the graphics driver, than W10 itself!

Note that my PC uses the onboard graphics chip.

tandeejay

29-03-2016, 11:24pm

Took the plunge and upgraded my 7yr old PC to win10...

All seems to be ok so far... only Sim Golf, and Stronghold 2 don't work... Stronghold 2 complains that I'm running a too old version of windows... wants win98 or higher...

One thing I did notice is that "shutdown" and "reboot" do not do the same thing...

That is... in win7, if I installed a driver update, and windows wanted a reboot after but gave an option to reboot now, or reboot later, if (as usually happens) I didn't want to reboot now, but was going to be shutting down in half an hour, I wouldn't reboot, and just shutdown knowing that the update would complete next time I turn it on...

Not so, windows 10... the default for "shutdown" is a hybrid hybernate, where it exits all user programs, and then hybernates the kernel... this is TOTALLY different to a "reboot" which actually shuts down the kernel so that when it starts, the kernel has to reload all its drivers and rebuild all its memory structures.

The Hybrid hybernate shutdown doesn't cause the kernel to restart, so the driver requiring a restart doesn't get that restart, which is a real problem when you have a driver that does not handle the hybernate correctly... which is a valid reason for a driver update... but shutdown, then boot, (not a true reboot) and the driver crashes on the "restore from hybernate" and windows automatically rolls back the driver update that is supposed to correct that...

Moral is, if the system tells you it needs a reboot, make sure you do a reboot before you shutdown...

Lance B

30-03-2016, 12:11am

A strange anomaly with C1P, maybe.

I've loaded a few image editing/viewing programs on W10, including but not limited to CaptureNX2, ViewNX2, Lr 4(something), FSViewer and even Windows Photo Galley .. all holdovers from the W7 to W10 upgrade .. and no settings issues there.

As I upgraded from W7 to W10, I thought I'd try the Photoshop trial again for a month .. just to see if it'd give me that month again(already used up on W7) ..and it worked.
All worked good, albeit slowly via ACR and Bridge again .. no problems(other than long wait times).

I'd say, as it's an Open CL/hardware acceleration related issue, then it probably had more to do with the graphics driver, than W10 itself!

Note that my PC uses the onboard graphics chip.

Yes, it was the graphics driver. I uploaded the latest firmware and I can now use the Hardware Accelertaion. All good now. :)

arthurking83

30-03-2016, 6:36am

Yes, it was the graphics driver. I uploaded the latest firmware and I can now use the Hardware Accelertaion. All good now. :)

Thought so.
I'm guessing is was Nvidia too .. only because I remember early on I had a problem with someone elses PC using an Nvidia graphics card/chip.
It was when the W10 upgrade was still new/fresh .. and I can't recall whose PC or laptop it was .. but, a newly updated driver from Nvidia(do they really need 300+ mb for their drivers!? :confused013)

Apart from the odd stray driver here and there, I haven't really experienced any W10 upgrade issues like some others seem to have had.

TDJay .. interesting to hear about the shutdown/reboot thingy.

Didn't even cross my mind that shutdown would have been implemented that way, but makes perfect sense, as bootup would then be quicker as well.

The first 'PC' I was itching to update, was my Win tablet which originally had W7Pro, and having experienced Win8 as not very enticing on a lappy, I skipped as an upgrade.
Being a tablet, it'd have benefited from Win8, but I didnt' like it to start with and then all the bad publicity came out about it.

So as soon I I'd heard about the W10 beta program I downloaded the beta version and installed it on my tablet.
Have been running it since then on the tablet .. and it's now all it should have been when it was fresh and new.
W7 on a tablet is a nightmare to use efficiently.
W8 may have been nice, but W10 is in a word :th3:

And I have wondered why start ups have always seemed snappier .. makes sense now.
ps. tablet has very meagre Atom CPU like hardware specs .. so you can imagine performance is not ideal. The only hardware spec I altered was a change from a diabolically tedious "1RPM" HDD to a much more usable SSD to give it some speed with W7. And of course the much nicer Killer WiFi card :th3:

ameerat42

30-03-2016, 9:42pm

This post is in this thread only because it happened in Win 10 for me, and the "fixes" relate to Win 10.

Late (that's important) last night I booted up a new lappy and was presented with a reduced number of icons
on the desktop and nothing in Documents, Pictures, and another made up folder on the Desktop. After a hasty
search of the usual folders I thought it best to do a virus scan. Nothing was reported. I shut down and felt
disturbed at losing data - though only a bit over a couple of weeks - but that did not make me feel any better.

This afternoon I started it up again and "everything seemed to be proceeding OK with the User Name coming up and everything".
But the screen balked and the reduced number of icons came up again. I then caught a glimpse of a message which read:
"You have been signed in with a temporary profile."

Amazingly, that made me feel immediately hopeful, so I went down looking in C:\Users... and found the name of the default user profile.
AND there were the lost folders!! Excited, I ran a scan with Malwarebytes and that also showed nothing. I re-started the machine - it seemed a
good idea at the time but I had no real reason to do so - and BINGO! - The machine booted up normally and displayed the proper profile, folders, etc.

I learnt that there is a problem that began in ??Win7 that sometimes the normal profile would not be signed in. Here are some links to the Win 10 problem:
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/insider/forum/insider_wintp-insider_security/windows-10-youve-been-signed-in-with-a-temporary/03b53fba-0c3e-48b9-b6a1-8382d51de633?auth=1
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2806301/windows-loads-temporary-profile.html

Just FYI.

tandeejay

30-03-2016, 9:56pm

AM, do you by any chance use a microsoft account to log in, or a local account?

I've always been reluctant to use a microsoft account for logins on home computers, as it means my access to my home computer becomes reliant on my internet connection.

ameerat42

31-03-2016, 9:43am

Nope. A local account. I shoudder specified that :o

tandeejay

31-03-2016, 2:31pm

Ok, then your problem isn't what I thought it might be :(

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ApolloLXII

01-04-2016, 9:27pm

After having attempted to upgrade my desktop twice already, only to be greeted with a System Exception error on both occasions, I finally managed to get the upgrade done. When it was finished, I was greeted with a large, black border around my screen and a crappy resolution. While everything else had been migrated over to Windows 10 successfully, my NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660Ti graphics card did not. The problem, according to the report in the Device Manager, was that the Registry entries for the card were incomplete or missing. A re-installation of the drivers for the graphics card solved the problem and now everything is running smoothly and I've got all of my screen back.

Lance B

01-04-2016, 10:10pm

The moral of the story is that any upgrade is generally not a smooth affair, especially if you have a couple pf programs that are slightly out of the mainstream. I think I have mine working right now, but this is a tentative, "everythings working ok" type of statement. I am reasonably ok with software, not brilliant, but I can usually work things out, but what about those poor souls that have no idea?

antony

14-06-2016, 11:11pm

So, after being constantly bombarded by Microsoft's ever aggressive Upgrade to Windows 10 message, I gave in.

I upgraded my Surface Pro 3 to Windows 10 finally. Smooth download and installation. I haven't experienced any issues so far apart I don't like Cortana taking a huge space on the Windows task bar.

Gazza

14-06-2016, 11:28pm

I haven't experienced any issues so far apart I don't like Cortana taking a huge space on the Windows task bar.
You could change that to an Icon by right clicking on it...:D

ameerat42

15-06-2016, 9:03am

Just a REMINDER:

The FREE aspect of this WIN 10 Upgrade is supposed to end this July, but I DUNNO if it's front, middle, or
end therof:confused013

tandeejay

16-06-2016, 10:31pm

Just a REMINDER:

The FREE aspect of this WIN 10 Upgrade is supposed to end this July, but I DUNNO if it's front, middle, or
end therof:confused013

It ends 29th July.

ameerat42

16-06-2016, 11:07pm

That's good, ta. I have one left to do:D
Where did you find that?

tandeejay

17-06-2016, 7:31pm

That's good, ta. I have one left to do:D
Where did you find that?

From the Microsoft website here (http://www.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/windows-10-upgrade?pm=pse_pma&SEMID=1&WT.srch=1&ocid=PMWIN10_SEM_bmc_pma_goo_en-AU_windows%2010%20upgrade&wt.mc_id=PMWIN10_SEM_bmc_pma_goo_en-AU_windows%2010%20upgrade) in the fine print right at the bottom of that page...

antony

17-06-2016, 10:04pm

You could change that to an Icon by right clicking on it...:D

Thank you.

tandeejay

18-06-2016, 9:48am

Was getting annoyed about how hard my hard drive was getting hammered after boot, and went investigating to find a process CompatTelRunner.exe consuming large amounts of disk IO.

Found this article about it with a method to disable if it is really annoying you: http://superuser.com/questions/944067/windows-disk-i-o-100-at-boot-for-20-minutes

ameerat42

18-06-2016, 9:53am

Ta for that. I have never had the issue. Also, I just checked the processes and did not see it.

tandeejay

18-06-2016, 1:08pm

Ta for that. I have never had the issue. Also, I just checked the processes and did not see it.

were you checking within the 1st 20 minutes of booting? I think it runs at 3am, or if your computer isn't on at 3am, it will run immediately on boot.

ameerat42

18-06-2016, 1:54pm

On boot, it's up and available after about 10-12 sec, then "finishes" a couple of checks
(like antivirus updates) by about 20 sec. Now on next startup will check again.

...
^A bit after that the external HDD went for a spin for several minutes. Didn't see the process
going at the time. Otherwise, this machine has SSDs. Do they do the same thing?

tandeejay

18-06-2016, 2:57pm

I've got spinning hard disks... I'm probably being hit with massive seek times that your SSD wouldn't have.

ameerat42

24-07-2016, 2:17pm

Did anyone do a clean install of Win 10 using their old Win 7 or Win 8 Product Keys?

How did it go?

When did it ask you for the Product Key?

Ta.
Am.

arthurking83

24-07-2016, 5:11pm

Yeah, I've done a couple now.
That is, I've done upgrades first, then I committed to 10 and did a clean install.

It asks you for the product key pretty early on in the routine, and you use the product key from your previous version.
I don't remember it asking for confirmation of the old product CD/DVD or anything like that either.

Back then: the only thing that p-eed me off was they they hadn't created an official USB key method for W10 via the USB DVD Download tool M$ has available .. so had to do a bit of a hack for that.
Can't remember what I did to get it working tho, it was way back then(and I can barely remember what I just typed in the above line, let along how I did something a year ago :p).
But, I now have a USB flavoured ISO and I can simply upload it to a USB drive and install from there.

While this is probably not important to many, there are some devices(ie. tablet types! ;)) that basically need this method .. or you need to stuff about trying to locate an external USB DVD drive or whatever.

ameerat42

24-07-2016, 5:15pm

Ta AK. I thought that would be the case, and I was telling someone else about it. I have told him the gist of your reply.
Somehow, he thought to do a clean install you needed to buy a copy of W10. As I had not done one I couldn't verify.
Basically, that key can no longer then be used for Win7 or 8 again.
Ta.
Am.

arthurking83

24-07-2016, 5:32pm

......
Basically, that key can no longer then be used for Win7 or 8 again.
Ta.
Am.

I have no idea, as I haven't tried it. But you would expect it not too. :confused013

ps. a major reason to do a clean install is that it saves quite a fair few gigs of HDD space .. on a 1Tb mechanical HDD, not an issue, but on a piddly 128G SSD, it adds up to a major amount.

On an upgrade, the W10 install saves all your old OS settings in a directory on your main drive(usually C:\) called Windows.old
This is important to keep intact if you ever want to go back to your older version.
But the size of that directory can be huge. The smallest I've seen so far(on my tablet) was 12Gig because it saves all your old software settings. A hundred Meg here and there all add up, and the tablet has as minimal software as I can muster(for the sake of this small capacity SSD I've installed.
On my Main PC(this one) where almost all the software currently available for download and installation has been installed .. the old directory inflated to well over 30gig. 1Tb drive .. so wasn't a problem.
I did however (almost) completely shift delete that directory once I felt confident that W10 was a better option.

ps. I say 'almost' completely delete that directory as there are two 1kb files that I simply can't remove, and I've tried almost every possible method(that I've researched).
Just won't delete, as they're locked. So the insanely complicated directory structure is still intact for those two files, all but 2kb's of 30+ gigs have been removed.

pps. those two files have nothing to do with Windows/MS/ or any other important software. Just two different versions of my phone backups that I didn't clear out before I upgraded.

I'm planning on doing a clean install on this main PC one day, but it's running so smoothly and quickly, there is no reason to upset the apple(oops, sorry!) .. I meant, Windows cart :D

thegrump

24-07-2016, 6:53pm

Just finished installing it. Took several hours. Asked many questions, many I had no answer to, so lets see how thing perform.

ameerat42

24-07-2016, 7:09pm

TG. This will be you enjoying Win 10: :) :D :lol: :nod:

- - - Updated - - -

---At least, after you fix a few settings:eek:

arthurking83

24-07-2016, 7:15pm

Oh!
I don't remember it taking several hours tho.
I reckon well under an hour on all machines I've done it for so far.
3 in my house, one for my sis(work PC) and one for a friend.
Apart from my sis's work PC, none of the machines were notably high specced either. low-mid paced CPUs and all mid ranged HD specs too(in terms of speed).

My sis's very fast, higher end PC still felt the same install speed tho. It may have been quicker(dunno, as I didn't really time them) but it didn't feel quicker on install(ie. no surprises).

But as I remember, they all took under an hour to install fresh or upgrade.
Of course reinstalling all the required software/drivers and whatnot takes time tho. Sometimes It takes me weeks to remember to get it all loaded again.

ameerat42

24-07-2016, 7:17pm

Well, my own fast laptop took 50 mins IN TOTal. All of the other 9 machines took from just over an hour
to a couple of hours each. It seems to muchly depend on the "power" of the machine. However, every one
of them has never faltered.

Anyway, if you want to wait a long time, try a "factory reset" on a lappy:eek::nod::(

--And how many updates of the previous OS it needs to do before it's ready to do the Win 10 "update".

CathyC

25-07-2016, 3:00pm

well, I bit the bullet and have updated the laptop (W7) to windows 10 - so far so good :) it took several hours to go through the whole process. I selected custom install and told it I would decide which apps would use for pics, videos etc. the first thing I tried when it was finished was to get on the net, visit here, kick up photoshop/indesign/bridge etc, do some web mail - all of those programs work just fine. So, hoping there are no issues in the next few days, then I can decide whether I want to upgrade the main PC (W8.1)

ameerat42

25-07-2016, 3:12pm

By all means, do:nod::nod::nod:

You've got until the 29th of July before you have to pay for it (unless they've extended the deadline).
I'm about to do my 10th machine (well, not all mine by any means:D).
My main laptop was 8.1 before the upgrade. Thought I'd miss it - NOPE! Never looked back.

Any problems, post here.

thegrump

25-07-2016, 6:42pm

Well it's the next day and everything seems alright so far. Except it keeps telling me that Firefox is not my my my um um um something ( COME ON BRAIN WORK ). So I click on to set it and it gives me this great list of thing, and I do not know what half of them are, and it does not tell me what to do with them if I did. I will get my son ( who has every IT certificate known to man and a few more ) to look at it. If I can get him around here any time soon. One thing that did happen, was as it was installing it asked me to click on something and the laser mouse was not working. So I turned on the wireless mouse and that was working. I unplugged the laser mouse while it was installing. When it was finished I plugged the laser back in and it worked. I AM NOT COMPUTER SAVVY.

ameerat42

25-07-2016, 7:29pm

TG. It's telling you that FFox is not your default browser (and that it is probably Edge, instead).
I do remember having a spot of BOVVer telling Win 10 to make FFox my default browser, and then it did.

It just means that for the present, it will choose (likely) Edge to open any HTML files.

thegrump

25-07-2016, 7:49pm

am.. That's it... Senior moment. Thanks

ameerat42

25-07-2016, 7:52pm

BTW, D:eek:N'T expect Cortana to work properly for you.
I tried to activate the speech part... and went around and
around in SQUARES till I gave up. (And did a bit of SQUARing:o)
It's OK for typing, though.

ameerat42

27-07-2016, 3:09pm

Pretty close to LAST CALL! for Free Win 10 Upgrade...

Just started my 10th and LAST free upgrade - a little Dell desktop running Win 7

Hope it goes ;)

At this moment we had 3 days; 4hrs; 49mins left to get it for free.

ameerat42

27-07-2016, 4:20pm

WOW! SUCCESS!!
Considering this little old machine had never had a Win 7 update as it was never on-line...

So that took a bit over an hour:th3:

- - - Updated - - -

Specs:

Core2Duo E7500, 2.93GHz
4GB RAM
32-bit OS
150GB HDD

benwheeler

27-07-2016, 8:37pm

For anyone who feels confident reinstalling all their stuff, I'd always recommend doing a clean install. It basically makes your computer brand new again, assuming you don't have any hardware problems.

When doing a clean install, you can enter your Win 7/8 product key and your hardware will be used to uniquely identify you by Microsoft. If you perform a subsequent clean install, you can tell the installer that you don't have the product key with you, and it will work out later that you're already registered.

Cortana can be completely removed by right-clicking the start bar, and under "Cortana" selecting "Hidden".

ameerat42

27-07-2016, 9:21pm

What do you mean by "brand new again"? Only that it makes you re-install all your other programs?

Does this not mean that you must have some knowledge of what you're doing, and a lot of time on your
hands to go to all that effort? What is the benefit? Your 2nd paragraph needs more explaining.

The upgrade is an automated process. In 10 upgrades I have done, only once did I have to reinstall
a touchpad driver. That was also easy enough.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't do a clean install if they want to, but it's a more involved process
given that you have to reinstall EVERY other program as well.

benwheeler

27-07-2016, 9:53pm

Yes, I have some knowledge of what I'm doing. I don't consider it to be a lot of effort to reformat, and it has gotten much easier over the years due to many factors:

- I think it's best to minimise the programs installed on a computer for best performance, and the proliferation of cloud services facilitates this

- Faster internet services mean downloading large updates and driver packages isn't a big deal

- Windows does most of the configuration work for you now

- Thanks to Google, all my bookmarks, passwords etc are still in place

So it really only takes a couple of hours to completely start again.

As for why to do it in the first place - Windows excels (ha ha) at collecting endless thousand of files and registry entries, all of which conspire to slow down your system. Maybe there are better ways these days of keeping things cleaned up, but in my experience there's no better way of getting your computer running like a sparkling new one than a good reformat.

ameerat42

27-07-2016, 10:02pm

OK, thanks for explaining. It's for the sake of giving people some info about the choices they have.
Am.

martycon

27-07-2016, 10:56pm

It is possible to banish Cortana from sight. Did it somehow. Right click its shortcut for options, I think.

ameerat42

27-07-2016, 10:58pm

It is possible to banish Cortana from sight. Did it somehow. Right click its shortcut for options, I think.

:confused013Search me:confused013 - I mean "Search Windows". That's all Cortana tells me:(

JDuding

28-07-2016, 8:55am

I rarely use my Win10 box, so far.
But all this Cortana talk got me interested.

So I found this article on what it is, why it is and how to minimise it as much as possible, seeing as it now "Can Not" be turned off.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/3100358/windows/you-cant-turn-off-cortana-in-the-windows-10-anniversary-update.html

I'll continue to avoid the Win 10 box as much as possible.
That might sound easy, but it is the unit that I use to PP my snaps.
So it is getting plenty of use of late. but, at least I only need it for a few tasks, then back to the comfort of my Lappy. :nod:

Edit: can't find the 'Linus van Pelt' emote :confused013

Lance B

28-07-2016, 9:04am

Did my main computer a number of months ago. No major issues and I don't mind the new version, still liked W7 better though.

Just did my laptop and it seems ok.... so far!

ameerat42

28-07-2016, 9:07am

Don't forget: after (about) 1 month you CAN'T go back to earlier version with the same product key.

- - - Updated - - -

JD: You don't really have to disable it. It doesn't really work anyway:D

ameerat42

29-07-2016, 7:59pm

:(:(TIME'S UP! --- for the FREE version (give or take some hours for US time).:(:(

Filter

30-07-2016, 8:43am

Hey, it's this posts 1st birthday, well done MS.

ameerat42

01-08-2016, 9:00am

In Win 10, when I open the Downloads Folder for the first time or after a long time, I get the
progress bar and "Working on it" message as shown below.

It lasts up to 10 sec. Subsequent opens of the folder display it immediately. The computer is a
laptop with two SSDs. I can't remember seeing it on the other machines running Win 10 with
spindle HDDs. Does anybody know why/what's happening?

Ta.

What I get...
127191

Gazza

01-08-2016, 9:14am

I get the same, more so when accessing another drive...wait until you do a simple search looking for a long lost image, it's time for a tea/coffee/beer then :D :D

ameerat42

01-08-2016, 9:20am

Hmm! Ta. I must say, I've only ever noticed it on Downloads, and that's on the C drive.
Will check others later (after some time or on next switch on). I wonder if the OS is doing
a TRIM? But it would not be doing that for you if you do not have SSDs. (Hmm! -???)

After a moment's reflection: No, of course not a TRIM. That's for the whole drive, isn't it?

[???] Hmm! [/???]

Speedway

01-08-2016, 11:25am

I often get this. My system has 1 128GB SSD as the system disc (C) plus 7 other various size HDD's 4 internal plus 2 USB2 and 1 USB3 external drives and as Gazza said a coffee or beer while waiting for a search result.
Cheers
Keith.

127192

ameerat42

01-08-2016, 12:04pm

Ta Speedway. I guess it's just part of Win 10. I remember it never happened with Win 8 and 8.1.
I guess there are worse ways to spend 5-10 sec.:D

benwheeler

01-08-2016, 12:54pm

Perhaps the operating system is turning off hard drives to save power? If so, you can change that under Power Settings in the control panel.

ameerat42

01-08-2016, 1:02pm

Ta Ben. The thing is that the Downloads folder is on C drive, and that's always going.
Do SSDs have such a feature?

JDuding

02-08-2016, 8:45pm

In Win 10, when I open the Downloads Folder for the first time or after a long time, I get the
progress bar and "Working on it" message...

Thinking on this and have recalled when this would happen to me using Win8.
Not sure if it was just the downloads folder.
But I did work out that it would happen if one of the files in that folder had a damaged/corrupt thumbnail.
In the end I just stopped using the Downloads folder and any of the main system standard folders (such as Music or My Documents etc).

Just suggesting that it might not be a Win10 specific issue. just a corrupt file.

benwheeler

02-08-2016, 9:04pm

I just looked at the default power option settings on my laptop. The hard drive will turn off after either 10 or 20 min, depending on if the computer's plugged in. It's a Windows setting rather than a feature of the drive itself. Although, you'd think an SSD would snap into action pretty swiftly.

Anyway, just a possible cause.

Warbler

03-08-2016, 12:00pm

Hip, hip, HOORAY! No more reminders from Microsoft about upgrading to Windows 10.....at long last. :efelant:

Kym

03-08-2016, 12:12pm

Win 10 1607 (anniversary edition) updates 2 x home and 1 x pro -- no issues at all.

Force update from here https://www.microsoft.com/en-au/software-download/windows10

3.6GB download (on NBN Fibre 100mps was only ~ 12 minutes)

ameerat42

08-10-2016, 2:39pm

Well, I got the Anniversary update a week or so back. Same here - no issues. Sure, it looks
like they've changed the "Start" button menu a bit, and the calculator now has a (still annoying)
History pane that I can't seem to close, but...:confused013

John King

08-10-2016, 4:13pm

ameerat42

08-10-2016, 4:18pm

Yes, that update was rather!!!
And it took aaaaaaaaaaaggggeessss to do.

tandeejay

08-10-2016, 9:29pm

And the update breaks nForce raid arrays. So if your boot drive is on an nForce array you won't be able to boot after the update. Instructions on how to get nForce arrays recognised by the latest Win10 update are here : http://www.win-raid.com/t2202f37-HOT-Win-Update-makes-nForce-RAID-arrays-unaccessable-17.html

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

arthurking83

09-10-2016, 9:41am

The size of that update package is interesting.

WinNT4 Server took around 36x1.44MB floppies for a full installation distribution, IIRC.

MS seems to have really badly lost the plot when an update is 70x larger ...

The distro DVD for Win7Pro is only 2.32GB ...

XP Pro shipped on a 650MB CDR, with space to spare ...

Not really getting the point, other than:
with every generation of OS, the added features seem to inflate the size of the OS/update packages :confused013

surprised? Not really.

DOS was an all encompassing OS itself too, and only fit on a single (properly!)floppy drive .. not 36 of them :D
But what did it allow you to do, other than type some stuff, for it to display some other stuff back at 'ya.

May sound alarmist that WinNT server was only about 50-ish Mb in total, but can you edit and make movies without installing other software?
Can you ask it questions to assist you to find stuff?
Can you natively play music, and have it remember your favourite stuff?
Can you run it on a tablet ....

(ps, list goes on for ever as to the differences in features)

crus of the problem is:
People(in general) seem to be lazy(myself included), and they seem to want everything to do everything for them! It appears that their computing environment isn't excluded from this desire to maintain their lack of enthusiasm to do stuff themselves .. so they(appear too) want stuff like Cortana, and music playing stuff, and movie making stuff .. ad infinitum.

And the update breaks nForce raid arrays. So if your boot drive is on an nForce array you won't be able to boot after the update. .....

Hopefully lesson learned!

Don't use raid(especially 0!!) for boot drives/important drives!!

Learned that lesson many years back.

Nothing wrong with raid arrays, but not for the critical stuff like OS.
Use raid for secondary storage stuff, or cache areas, or whatever.

In saying that tho, I guess raid 1 could work fine for OS drives.
Never done it(never needed/wanted), but if the drive is simply mirrored(for redundancy) then if the raid array is borked, then in theory the single drive should still function as per normal in a non raid environment.

tandeejay

09-10-2016, 11:24am

Never use raid 0 for anything. My disks were raid 1. I'm all back up and running now with full raid 1 as I like :)

Really is time for me to upgrade my 9 yr old motherboard... :)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

arthurking83

09-10-2016, 1:36pm

Never use raid 0 for anything. My disks were raid 1. I'm all back up and running now with full raid 1 as I like :)

....

:th3:

So, did you try taking out one of the disks and checking to see if it boots up as per normal with the raid feature disabled?

I'm not 100% sure how(the guts of) raid works, but if raid 1 stripes the data across the two disparate drives, and doesn't use or need parity, then the data on one drive should be just that .. the data needed to boot into the drive again.

I recently got myself a new 4 bay NAS and I don't use the RAID features at all. RAID 5 sounds nice until you think about the complete loss of one drive's capacity just for the sake of maintaining parity! :confused013
So I just set them all up as 4 separate drives, and have two drives dedicated to just my images on the NAS.
I figure that the chances of both drives giving up the ghost at the exact same time is very remote, and that if a drive does give up, I'll more than likely have the ability/time to secure the data on the drive that still works.

I reckon I'm still ahead in using this method because on my third drive of those images, it doesn't have to be one of the same size. So I have a backup of a backup to a primary source .. ie. raid 5 but without the limitations(eg. of required same drives, etc).

I also found out the hard way that sometimes you don't want auto backing up(that is basically what backup type raids do).
A few years ago, I was doing my normal routine backup not realising that the source data was corrupted, so the backup data was overwriting basically good data.
That's what a raid will do .. if one of the drives is fed with corrupt data it simply writes that same corrupted data to the next drive in the array.
So while you may have had uncorrupted data on the other drive, it will then also become corrupted.

I lost a pile of about 15 NEF files during a transfer. The files didn't appear corrupted in any way until I tried to open them in any software .. only to get file not supported.
Turned out that most of those files were shot copies of similar images I did on a shoot .. so no biggie. I think maybe one of those images may have had some value to it, so it's loss was briefly mourned(but then just as quickly forgotten).

Now I do all my backups manually. I use a combo of sync(free file sync is awesome for that! .. highly recommended) and file copying of specific files only(ie. new or updated).
For OS, I think regular system images are the best shot for backups rather than raid.

about the only advantage I can see for wanting/needed raid nowadays is RAID 5 on a local machine. And that's really only for a bit more speed of data access whilst maintaining some security of that data.
But SSDs are getting so cheap now, that this is now also becoming less of an advantage.

The only other reason to use raid is for the geek factor(and I admit I'm a geek).
I just finished my new PC, and will soon also add a couple more SSDs to the mix(I'm basically trying to conserve some power maintaining all these HDDs.
Anyhow, I'll soon have a couple of spare 1Tb drives, and I'll keep them active for a bit once the new SSDs are installed as replacements.

I'll then set those two HDDs in a raid setup, but they'll be non critical geekware type playthings :D

John King

09-10-2016, 1:37pm

Not really getting the point, other than:
with every generation of OS, the added features seem to inflate the size of the OS/update packages :confused013

surprised? Not really.

DOS was an all encompassing OS itself too, and only fit on a single (properly!)floppy drive .. not 36 of them :D
But what did it allow you to do, other than type some stuff, for it to display some other stuff back at 'ya.

May sound alarmist that WinNT server was only about 50-ish Mb in total, but can you edit and make movies without installing other software?
Can you ask it questions to assist you to find stuff?
Can you natively play music, and have it remember your favourite stuff?
Can you run it on a tablet ....

(ps, list goes on for ever as to the differences in features)

crus of the problem is:
People(in general) seem to be lazy(myself included), and they seem to want everything to do everything for them! It appears that their computing environment isn't excluded from this desire to maintain their lack of enthusiasm to do stuff themselves .. so they(appear too) want stuff like Cortana, and music playing stuff, and movie making stuff .. ad infinitum.

That's fair enough too, Arthur. I prefer the OS and its associated file system to be robust and supportable, rather than some sort of all singing, all dancing wonder system ...

I have just had to reboot my wife's w/s because it was running a bit slowly. The h/w is about 9 y.o., and runs XP Pro. It had been running continuously for just over 40 days ...

That's what I refer to as "reliable and robust" :nod: :D.

BTW, my 'point' was that the programmers at MS (and Adobe, and ... ) seem to have forgotten how to write 'tight' code that just works properly, with decent error trapping and sensible help/prompts where necessary. They appear to be too entranced by the flashy/fashionable, rather than the mundane and robust.

YMMV.

arthurking83

09-10-2016, 1:55pm

I guess that's just inevitable that software will become bloated.

All those 'user friendly' features that help you find stuff, do stuff, see stuff, etc .. or in the case of Adobe .. clone stuff without really trying! ;) .. it all needs more code.
And the chances that bugs and security issues arise when more code is written for those features is higher .. so more code is needed to fix the badly written bloated code already present.

ps. my preference is usually for the mundane and robust too .. don't misunderstand my point, that this is just inevitable.

And for sure it will grow exponentially in the future too. I reckon it won't be too long before a dual layer blue ray disk is needed just for the minor updates! :p

Wondering if anyone knows if M$ still have the old system where you could download cumulative updates, save them to the PC, and or integrate them into a new copy of the installation media?

The biggest major PITA with the move to Win10 has been this Update system debacle.
I just got a new PC up and running and would have preferred to use that old system for installing updates.

Also! Operating systems suppliers(mainly Apple and M$) should work out a system of excluding the updates from people internet service provider's download allowances.
This is where the issue of size of updates is going to hurt many.
They seem to think that we're all billionaires with unlimited access to $'s and data plans!

ps. Win10 Pro with all it's features and bloat ware is 5.5Gb in size .. so a dual layer DVD. That's not as bad as it could have been. Oh and I delete all the crap like 3D builder, Groove, Movies, and whatnot

benwheeler

09-10-2016, 4:22pm

Also! Operating systems suppliers(mainly Apple and M$) should work out a system of excluding the updates from people internet service provider's download allowances.
This is where the issue of size of updates is going to hurt many.
They seem to think that we're all billionaires with unlimited access to $'s and data plans!

Good luck with that.. It's been a long time since I've even seen a plan available that would mean downloading 5gb is an imposition. Unless you're restricted to a SIM plan, I think it's time to change internet providers!

ameerat42

09-10-2016, 4:34pm

...It's been a long time since I've even seen a plan available that would mean downloading 5gb is an imposition. Unless you're restricted to a SIM plan, I think it's time to change internet providers!...

...Except for "most-of-the-people-who-live-in-the-boosh":D

benwheeler

09-10-2016, 4:43pm

I see.. Well, that's a shame! Anyway, I guess Microsoft coming to an agreement with every ISP in Australia to provide free updates to keep those in the bush happy is fairly unlikely..

arthurking83

09-10-2016, 6:07pm

updating just the one PC, and lets say it's 3 or 4 .. or 5Gb update being pushed .. basically, not a problem other than speed in some instances.

But add another PC or two .. that 3-5Gb adds up, and the frequency that they push out some of these updates is getting shorter.
Lets say a household is now at 3 or 5 PCs, they may not all be on at the same time to take advantage of M$s update sharing scheme either .. maybe they're not even all interconnected on the network or something like that too.

Basically, it's a bit of a mess really. imagine you're on a supposedly unlimited plan, which for many situations can really mean a 100G limit, or limited to 50 G during peak times and completely unlimited off peak.
How many people have the presence of mind to leave their computer on during the week hours that is offpeak?

And that's just the OS download requirements!
Add Office, which many folks have and use! ... where 1Gb major service pack updates aren't uncommon .. add updates to other software(Adobe's CC malarky is another classic example)

Johns' point that the size of these updates has merit in that once you add up everything .. when you add up all the data necessary to appease some of those supposed 'entertainment broadband' packages will be continuously churning through data like voracious parasites.

Any wonder I'm struggling to achieve 10Mb/s sometimes on my supposedly 100Mb/s cable plan!
All these parasites chewing up bandwidth just to be up to date! :D

Add to the problem that the turnbullsh!t idiot cheapened NBN with 20th century 'fibre to the node', and there's no real alternative to cable (for speed) ... and the issue is one big mess that is going to become a bigger mess in the future due to congestion.

John King

09-10-2016, 7:08pm

^ Exactly, Arthur.

We currently have 8x PCs + 1x laptop in the house! Some will (eventually ... ) be going out the door, but 3.6 GB x 9 would start to be plain ridiculous! We have HFC cable here, so 116 Mbps down (only 2.5 Mbps up - :dummyspit: - upload is limited by the existing exchange h/w, not the transmission h/w or modality).

I have run Gbps Ethernet over Cat 2 cable (ordinary 2 pair telephone cable). Cat 5/6 is preferable, of course.

Coaxial cable will run as fast as you can pump data into it, just don't expect it to do it for hundreds of simultaneous connections, and no one is suggesting this model.

ameerat42

13-10-2016, 1:24pm

Newly discovered (by me:o) in WIN 10 - a handy network/bandwidth meter.

It was probably in Win 8 as well and I just didn't notice it:o
Quick way of checking internet performance:nod:

(For complete novices only: Ctrl-Alt-Del, then Task Manager, then set up screen as below.)
(Set View to "Always on top".)

Well, FWIW, here it is...
128275

Warbler

29-10-2016, 10:56am

For those like me, who tried and rejected Win10, you may be experiencing some difficulty using tasks like Backup. When you revert to win7 from win10, the task scheduler gets screwed up sometimes. I could no longer run a backup and got a message about "The task images is corrupt or has been tampered with". I was getting around this by using robocopy.exe to backup my files. Robocopy is fine for backing up files, but it won't create a system image and I had not updated my system image for quite some time. Anyway, I got sick of that and did some searching on the net and found that this was a common problem that came about from restoring windows 7 from win 10. There is a solution that is an exe file that you can download from:

https://repairtasks.codeplex.com/

I've downloaded it and run it. It restored 76 corrupt tasks, the vast majority of which I was not aware were no longer running. Things like automatic updates for Java and other applications. Anyway, I'm posting it in case you are struggling with this issue and want to try a solution that worked for me.