Nikon D810 thread

[arthurking83]

Nikon's D810 announcement is imminent any moment now(apparently).

Just read a leaked/whoopsie on NR on some of it's specs.
Interesting ISO rates being stated in that release. Base ISO at 64 with an extended low of down to 32.
Base high ISO doesn't change and is still 12800, but can now extend up to ISO 51.2K (25,600 was the upper limit for the D800 twins)

Focus improvements were to be expected, and would love to update just for this feature. (Of course I won't .. no need for an update at my end).
The other almost alluring feature is the electronic first curtain(shutter) .. minimises vibrations in many situations.

There are claims being made that the sensor now at 36.3Mp is new.
I can't imagine that being totally true ... tweaked, maybe but new is hardly believable. To make a new sensor and not boost it's base high ISO ability when you know your competitor will! .. seems like an opportunity lost to me.

THIS (cached site) (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:C2Df7iEki0UJ:www.expertreviews.co.uk/dslrs/1400399/nikon-d810-review-first-look-release-date-and-price+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=bg) is claiming that the new sensor is 36.3Mp whereas the old sensor was 36.2Mp.
(this link is copied here courtesy of NikonRumour. It's a cached website that had uploaded this review a bit too early)
But the overall number of pixels on the sensor was apparently 36.8Mp .. as there are always some pixels that don't get used(at the periphery).
So I think these numbers are 'marketing speak' (read that as marketing BS!) from Nikon.
Anyhow .. directly compared images will reveal the newness factor.

Anyhow .. I'm curious as to what others think of the update.
I didn't think that the D800 needed an update actually.
I'd have thought that a D400 would have been a bigger sales success(going by the number of internet people seemingly waiting for it).

Unless higher ISO image quality is somehow improved by a few magnitudes .. I can't see myself updating for a while.

[I @ M]

As an update from a D800 there doesn't seem much tempting at all really, at least for the way I use one.
For those considering a Nikon body to replace their older generation units there is plenty to be liked about this evolution --- apart from the price. :D

[bconolly]

I agree Arthur that a D400 would have been a better marketing bet. Everything I've seen from the D800 / E still seems to indicate it's, on balance, the best DSLR on the market. I don't think that the D810 has added anything that is going to extend that longevity. Sure the better focus performance is an excellent addition, but it's not like the current AF in the D800's is poor. To be honest I'm quite please they're releasing the D800 cause I might finally be able to afford a D800E ;-)

Brenden

[Sifor]

Looks nice, but not enough to make me want to upgrade my D800. Buying new for the first time sure it'd be great, but for replacing current D800/e versions well unless you really need the best for work, or have plenty of cash to play with, probably best to sit tight!

[fillum]

Focus improvements were to be expected, and would love to update just for this feature.What is the issue with the current models AK - is it AF speed? How would you rate your D800E for focus speed compared to your D300? (I'm thinking about sport here...)

(Since you mentioned the D400...) This is an odd one. My feeling is that it's "in the works" somewhere but has been held up by manufacturing or technical problems. If there is to be no D400 (or whatever it would be called), or if the long delay since the D300 had been planned, then surely a D310 in the interim would have been a 'no-brainer'. The only thing the D300 needs (for stills) is better high ISO performance, so drop in a new sensor, make a few other tweaks (eg beef up the vid) and Bob's yer proverbial.




Cheers.

[arthurking83]

Focus speed has been more than enough for me in my limited sports shooting attempts.
They include kids soccer and some karting.
Strangely I thought that the karting was going to be easier than I actually found it to be(no matter the lens and mode).
That's certainly a limitation at my end than the camera tho.

By better focusing I should have said the group focus mode. Sounds like a feature that could make a differences in some situations.

I can't say that I've had any trouble with the focusing with either the D800E or the D300.
A nicer screen of manual focusing wouldn't hurt tho!
(viewfinder is a supposed improvement in the D810 in terms of brightness ... I'm waiting to read/hear what the experts have to say about this)

Actually having now seen the new specs, one thing of interest as an update path for me is the electronic front curtain and better balanced mirror mechanism.
With such high res sensors and high magnification lenses, this could make workflow a bit easier.
I can't remember having not used MUP and exposure delay modes in any of the macro shots I've taken .. but this has been a strategy I've used from the D300 anyhow.

From all the official updates posted by Nikon, 99% of them seem to be video based.

And in my first post I made a mistake and said that base ISO upper limit hadn't changed, where in fact it has. D800 twins are 6400, D810 is now 12800(apologies .. my whoopsie there)

Anyhow .. against other camera models the D810 seems to have a few features that keep it competitive.
As an update to the D800 tho, it seems to be less enticing unless video is a major thing in your life.

HERE'S the Nikon comparison sheet link (http://cdn-4.nikon-cdn.com/en_INC/o/57qXCcC4VtbrorNNsWOsXvKoNmM/PDF/D810-D800-D800E_Comparison_Sheet_en.pdf)

As an incidental issue(or curiosity) I'm wondering what they've done to the ISO ratings for each stop higher(or lower).
Now that base ISO is 64(and not 100 as before) each full stop is going to be 1/3rd Ev below what we've all become accustomed too.

ie. 100->200->400->800 .. etc until highest base ISO is reached(in the case of the D800/E .. ISO6400)
But now ISO indicators will (or should) read 64->125->250->500->1000->2000->4000->8000->12800 (instead of 16000 as the next full stop).

The lowering of ISO range down to ISO32 could be helpful to some who like to work with long shutter speeds too (as an improved feature).
I personally don't like using filters unnecessarily which include ND filters .. and only use them because I have too.(I only have one)

But a 2/3rds reduction can make a bit of a difference in some situations .. for example if you shutter speed had to be 8s at ISO50 .. at ISO32 it's more like 13s now. Makes water a bit more smoothy like and so on.
Again not a feature to make anyone upgrade .. but it's good to see manufacturers are looking at pushing lower ISO ranges too.
Lower ISO rates always help for those times when long shutter speeds are wanted.
I'd say this is a product of video features and requirements .. hopefully we'll see even lower ISO values into the future.

[Cage]

Just received the email from My Nikon Life.

Am I reading it correctly that the D810 is a combined replacement for the D800 and the D800E, with no Optical Low-Pass Filter ?

[I @ M]

Oh dear, what a let down.
Seems like the D800 has been pushed aside to make room for a consumer oriented toy. :(

Lighter than the D800 = flimsier cheaper parts used. :(
Made in Thailand = we all know what that means. :(
More of the useless video frippery added = they are no longer making products for photographers. :(
A new way to select metering = changed to using 2 hands like other consumer models instead of 1. :(

[arthurking83]

.....
A new way to select metering = changed to using 2 hands like other consumer models instead of 1. :(


All the other points don't concern me.

eg. D300 is a very reliable product(60K shutter operations and still OK) and made in that troubled part of the world.

Metering selector is a backward step tho. I'm wondering why it had to be changed?
Who asked for this?
Is it really that hard to turn a small out ring right near your thumb to select a different mode?
What happened to BKT?
With the massive rise in HDR over the years, is BKT no longer something many need access easily. :confused013

I'm betting the lightness advantage amounts to that 1gram of the metering mode selector ring! :D

[I @ M]

All the other points don't concern me.

eg. D300 is a very reliable product(60K shutter operations and still OK) and made in that troubled part of the world.

But that was before the factory was turned into an aquarium by a stray tsunami ----



What happened to BKT?

Moved around the front L/H to get confused with the flash buttons ----



I'm betting the lightness advantage amounts to that 1gram of the metering mode selector ring! :D

Nooooo!!! All to do with flimsy plastic bits used to compensate for all the other stuff added.

Think about it,

They added more buttons = more weight.
They added expeed 4 instead of 3 = bigger number is heavier.
They added an entire zebra skin or something = expect an online boycott from PETA.
They added more dots to the LCD screen = more dots equals more weight, naturally.
They added another microphone = more weight.

They have to make the weight savings from reduced quality plastics and tin foil.

[Lance B]

My name has been down at a large Sydney camera store for the new D810 since yesterday. I am first on their list for the new D810. :D Yesterday, they told me that the D810 announcement was due out tomorrow (today), which I knew anyway, and that the D800 and D800E would be discontinued. I also received notification about the new D810 from My Nikon Life. According to my source, the new cameras are supposedly being delivered mid to late next month.

[Norman]

Some pretty sound conclusions here it seems we are all ''underwhelmed'' i feel there is really no reason for me to upgrade at this stage

Some of my thoughts on Focusing speeds etc with the D800E here..

I sold my D3s recently and agonised over doing so , i had ran both it and the D3s together since getting the D800E and i gradually stopped using the D3s altogether, i use the E for mountain bike pics, fast jets etc i have found i am not spraying a target with shots and hoping for the best but am using the D800E ' slow frame rate very judiciously , i really don't think ive missed a shot and it makes me ''think'' more about what i am doing

I love the huge megapixal count and the wonderful colour tones it delivers, the ability to heavily crop if required and not see deterioration is amazing and worth every cent, put with good glass and you are really cooking

I wont be changing anytime soon

[I @ M]

My name has been down at a large Sydney camera store for the new D810 since yesterday.

Hope you got a better price here in Aus than the pommies are offering (http://blog.graysofwestminster.co.uk/) Lance. £2700 converts to roughly $4800.00 :eek:

[MissionMan]

I've local online stores advertising $3698 so its not quite $4800 but also not close to the $2800 that the D800 was going for before it was replaced.

[Cage]

Is this just Nikon distancing itself from the early D800/E problems, much like it has done with the D610 reincarnation of the D600.

I've only recently got the D800, love it, and won't be changing it anytime soon. I can live without the minuscule difference in IQ, and for my use, the OLPF is a plus.

[Lance B]

US price is $3,299.00, UK price is as you say, £2700, but Aussie price is always a tad more than the US price, I've seen $3598 at Digi Direct, Sydney.

[I @ M]

I've local online stores advertising $3698 so its not quite $4800 but also not close to the $2800 that the D800 was going for before it was replaced.

MM, never look at run out prices when comparing newly released models against superseded ones. Instead, look at what the old model initially hit the market at and in this case the D800 was around the 3,500 mark with the E model a couple hundred dearer. It doesn't take long for initial prices to start on the downward path.


US price is $3,299.00, UK price is as you say, £2700, but Aussie price is always a tad more than the US price, I've seen $3598 at Digi Direct, Sydney.

About what one would expect Lance, I just highlighted the UK price as an example of totally ridiculous levels in this so called "global" market place.

[MissionMan]

MM, never look at run out prices when comparing newly released models against superseded ones. Instead, look at what the old model initially hit the market at and in this case the D800 was around the 3,500 mark with the E model a couple hundred dearer. It doesn't take long for initial prices to start on the downward path.



About what one would expect Lance, I just highlighted the UK price as an example of totally ridiculous levels in this so called "global" market place.

I'm not looking at it from that perspective, I'm simply looking at it from the perspective of being a good time to pick up a D800 because you're saving about $1500 on a few features that may not impact the vast majority of photographers.

[I @ M]

I'm not looking at it from that perspective, I'm simply looking at it from the perspective of being a good time to pick up a D800 because you're saving about $1500 on a few features that may not impact the vast majority of photographers.

Yep, that aspect is very appealing. Usually the grey sellers want to clear "old" models from their supplies quickly so it is no surprise really to see D800 bodies listed at $2300.00 today.

Like all most models from the past, the D800 didn't suddenly stop taking great photos because the D810 came along ----

[MissionMan]

Yep, that aspect is very appealing. Usually the grey sellers want to clear "old" models from their supplies quickly so it is no surprise really to see D800 bodies listed at $2300.00 today.

Like all most models from the past, the D800 didn't suddenly stop taking great photos because the D810 came along ----

Of course they stop taking great pictures. My first decent camera was the D700 which I bought when the D800 first came out. The guys who bought D800's were taking much better photos. Oddly enough my D700 takes better photos now compared to 2 years ago when I first got it so maybe it just needed a run in period. :o)

[arthurking83]

Is this just Nikon distancing itself from the early D800/E problems, much like it has done with the D610 reincarnation of the D600.

......

Nah! too late for something like that.
D600->D610 was only about a year between 'models' and we all know this was an unadmitted admission of fault.

D800->D810 is a genuine update.

Nikon tend to have 2 1/2 - 3 year update cycles for their gear(which is why you might read many curious comments about the D300s replacement.
Some of the updates are genuine improvements(eg. screen, electronic first curtain, focusing group thingy etc) and not just pseudo updates.

Hardware wise, the D800 still holds up well in terms of being competitive.
For me, even if there were more hardware updates such as better sensor(even higher ISO quality, or more pixels) I'd probably have still missed this update.

I reckon about the only hardware update that would have swayed me to updating would have been a proper official replaceable focusing screen advancement.
As it is the D810 is supposedly a bit of an improvement with new better coatings or something, but the hardware is still basically the same.
I'd love to see Nikon doing replacement option screen types.

These things, along with the D4 and D7100 are targeted at people who may have a set of old manual lenses.

With the imminent prospect that EVF technology will have finally caught up with OVF hardware and even passed it, unless Nikon have future plans to adopt EVF systems into their DSLR range ... they really need to look into maintaining that one step ahead in viewfinder performance.

As for price .. as usual with photography gear. If you can hold off for about 6 months after release then you'll save yourself about $500ish at the least.
If this thing comes out in July .. then that puts this 6 month target at about Jan-Feb ... traditionally a good time of the year to purchase a DSLR(as this is the lowest point in sales trends).

[MissionMan]

The extra frame per second might also be enough to swing some people. There are a couple of things I'd like to see in it although I suspect they won't be there.

The one missing from the D800 (only D4) was the AF point rotating when you turned the camera from landscape to portrait mode.

[wedgtail]

I think Iwill sit tight on this one my D600 still does what I need .

[arthurking83]

Remember our conversation a few weeks back about having a focus point that follows your eye(re: fighter pilot technology)?

.... now that's a feature I'd update for!

Hopefully in the D820 ;)

[Lance B]

Remember our conversation a few weeks back about having a focus point that follows your eye(re: fighter pilot technology)?

.... now that's a feature I'd update for!

Hopefully in the D820 ;)

So would I! But not at fighter plane prices! :)

- - - Updated - - -


Remember our conversation a few weeks back about having a focus point that follows your eye(re: fighter pilot technology)?

.... now that's a feature I'd update for!

Hopefully in the D820 ;)

So would I! But not at fighter plane prices! :)

[swifty]

Didn't the EOS 3 and 5 have this eye-controlled focussing? Not sure of any subsequent models having this feature, especially in the digital era and of course a 2014+ version might work a little better.
Canon's patent on it (if there's a patent) would have expired years ago :)

[arthurking83]

I remember someone posted that Canon did have such a feature years ago .. can't remember who, or which camera.
Tech has moved so far since then tho .. it's sure to be an easier feature to implement now.

Patents can be got around quite easily .. change a small part, alter the colour of the highlighted point .. etc.

My guess is that the size of the technology could be the limiting factor.

But, if we could currently have focus technology that looks for and tracks faces and features such as 3D Focus Tracking(in Nikonspeak) .. why can't they reverse the system and have it track a specifically registered part of your eyeball?

[MissionMan]

I think it will be there eventually. It may be tough to implement. For example, the moment you look at the background to check if there are any distractions, focus moves to the background.

[arthurking83]

Ok .. so the question is .. are you going to open your wallet for the D810? :D

go on .. you know you have too now :p



ps. you better have one at the next meetup!

[MissionMan]

Ok .. so the question is .. are you going to open your wallet for the D810? :D

go on .. you know you have too now :p



ps. you better have one at the next meetup!

Still deciding which way to go but I have to wait for funds. It could be a good time for a D800 purchase with run out discounts. The challenge with the D810 is that when you add the cost of the battery grip, it moves over $4k and I can get a low shutter count D4 for that price.

I like the body with the grip on (size of my hands) but I'm not a fan of having to remove the grip to get access to the internal battery.

[Kym]

http://www.digitalcameraworld.com/2014/07/02/nikon-d810-vs-canon-5d-mark-iii-comparison-full-frame-dslrs/

[Damian Aimers]

Hi all. I have used canon for most of everything I do. However some months ago our car was broken into while on vacation and all camera gear, notebook and an external were stolen. I am more upset at the external as many of my children's photos are also now gone.
However, I have been procrastinating replacements for some time. This camera may be my changing point. I will have to buy all new glass anyway. I need to feel one first.

[Damian Aimers]

UPDATE: last night I pulled out the credit card and ordered a new Nikon d810 with a few tamron lens. Now the anticipated wait.