DSLR & Lens advice required for a beginner

[Doc63]

Hi all. I’ve been a member of this site for about a week or so now, and I must say, the amount of information here for the complete novice is overwhelming!! In addition, the quality of photos posted is amazing and inspiring.

I don’t currently have a DSLR, but I have begun saving towards one, so now is the time to ask that dreaded question – what do I need??

The types of photography that I am particularly interested in are:
Landscapes – particularly sunrises & sunsets
Streetscapes
Birds
Aeroplanes
Travel – again, landscapes & streetscapes, scenery wildlife (Africa).

For the camera itself, I was thinking something along the lines of the Nikon D5100, or its Canon equivalent, EOS 600D. I think any higher than that would be a bit of overkill at this stage.

But as for the lenses, I am pretty much confused. I have read here that it would be best to invest in a good Tamron or Sigma lens, rather than the kit lenses that come with the camera as a package deal. Budget will probably have a say here. A D5100 with 18-55mm + 55-200mm lenses would cost approx. $850, where the same camera with a Tamron 18-270mm costs over $1,000.

All advice will be very much appreciated. If I need to add any other details, please let me know.

Regards

Neil

[ricktas]

You seem to have which body already sorted, as in what level of camera you want.

I would say considering your penchant for a variety of genre at this stage, my suggestion would be an 18-200. That gives you a reasonably wide 18mm for the landscapes, and the 200 end will give you a reasonable zoom length for starting out with birding, planes etc.

Just getting the body and one lens will allow you to experiment, learn and have fun while doing so. Then once you have all the camera functions down pat, and start to advance your photography, you can then look at specific lenses for the differing genre, and expect to pay top $ for good quality pro-level lenses. In the meantime an 18-200 will let you enjoy the genre you want to, and learn. Using one lens, that stays on the camera body also lessens your need to do sensor cleans etc (another thing to learn as your photography advances).

[ameerat42]

Ah, this common theme: beginner (if you will excuse my presumption) seeks advice on advancement of gear.

Well, you did well to explain your shooting preferences. Your cameras of example are pretty good choices. I think that you won't get a definitive answer because there would be none. A good amount of research is evident, too, and in fact, you've almost supplied the answer yourself, the remainder being to make the choice.

Only general guidance would be: get the system that would (seem) to cover all or most of your photographic interests, according to your affordability. That may just come down to a standard, typical "twin-lens kit". But it would be a valuable starting point. It would get you learning the camera system and its capabilities. Soon enough you'd learn its limitations and then... - the next question along these lines.

Almost anything along the lines of what you have indicated would be a mean system.
Am.

(PS: Cripes: beaten again:D)

[AVALANCHE]

The Nikon D5100 and 18-200mm combo will serve you very well. You will be covered for almost every situation with that lens.

To break it down as a generalisation for your needs...

Want to shoot landscape? Shoot at 18mm-35mm
Street? 35mm-50mm
Portrait? 50mm-105mm
Birds? 200mm
Planes? 200mm

Especially for travel, this means less camera gear for you to lug around...

[extraball]

I would suggest the body of your choice without kit lenses, and choose a 18-200 as suggested. Buying from our sponsors, stock ex-china will save you probably 30% on aussie retail as well.

[Mary Anne]

If you want to shoot Birds/Aircraft you will need a much longer lens than a 200mm at the least 400mm Canon make a 100-400mm and 400mm.
More expensive than the Tamron you are looking at.. Don't know what Nikon has though I am sure they would have identical ones.
Sigma make one that is 50-500mm I think, though to me long angle is one area where I prefer to keep to the camera brand name.
I also agree about not getting the kit lens/lenses. Photography is not a cheap hobby and its worth it to keep saving for better lenses.

[ricktas]

If you want to shoot Birds/Aircraft you will need a much longer lens than a 200mm at the least 400mm Canon make a 100-400mm and 400mm.
More expensive than the Tamron you are looking at.. Don't know what Nikon has though I am sure they would have identical ones.
Sigma make one that is 50-500mm I think, though to me long angle is one area where I prefer to keep to the camera brand name.
I also agree about not getting the kit lens/lenses. Photography is not a cheap hobby and its worth it to keep saving for better lenses.

The Canon 100-400 is around $1500
The Sigma 50-500 is around $1200

The 18-200 is Nikon $600 Canon $500 Sigma $350.

Yes you will not get the reach of the 100-400 etc BUT as a beginner, investing in gear the $ is often a major factor. Once someone learns and discovers what genre they really like, then they can invest in better glass, if they want to pursue genre that need the reach of 400mm etc. I do get where you are coming from, but I think as an absolute beginner buying their first DSLR, $ might sway them away from a longer lens to begin with. The OP mentions the $1000 mark with the Tamron lens, so I took that to mean they don't want to spend to much, just yet!

[ameerat42]

^^Those lenses are hefty pieces of kit - hardly the stuff of a beginner. And as a beginner, do you want to be lugging around ~2Kg of kit for the odd angry shot?
OK, now the 18-200 is starting to sound like a goer for what you do and the stage you're at.
Advice (Oh perish the thought!): keep it simple and modest and feel your way into photography. DON'T think that "GEAR!-GEAR!-GEAR!" will solve all your
problems.
Am.

Edit: Just thought of something, Neil. Have you had/do you have any old film SLR gear. There may be some lenses you can use from that. I have used heaps
of older legacy lenses, and some have been really good. I have recently stopped using an old 75-205 manual lens because of other stuff I have (finally!!!) got.
That old lens was really good for definition and lack of (too many) aberrations.

[Mary Anne]

I agree with you Rick about Neil not wanting to spend that kind of money most beginners don't.
All I was trying to point out was if Neil wants to shoot birds then to keep saving for a better lens, Neil also mentioned Africa Wildlife
It will probably take some time and by then Neil should know more about photography and be happy to buy a longer lens if he still wants to shoot that genre.


And as a beginner, do you want to be lugging around ~2Kg of kit for the odd angry shot?

Am I cart more than that around most mornings for a couple of hours as my macro gear weighs 2398 gms and I think nothing of it even at my age, and its keeping me fit.
What has being a beginner got to do with how much you can carry around, and most people go out to shoot more than the odd angry shot as you put it.

[ameerat42]

...
Am I cart more than that around most mornings for a couple of hours as my macro gear weighs 2398 gms and I think nothing of it even at my age, and its keeping me fit.
What has being a beginner got to do with how much you can carry around, and most people go out to shoot more than the odd angry shot as you put it...

You have said it, M A - you are not Neil. You carry that weight of specialised gear for a purpose you have set yourself.
Neil is starting out, and I am sure he appreciates your advice as well as mine.
Am.

[Doc63]

Wow!! Thanks for all the advice everyone.

And yes, budget is an issue. I think starting off with a 18-200 lens sounds like a good idea, especially as I feel my way around. Then take it from there. The more I look into it, the more I appreciate just how expensive photography can be. So I think small steps to start off with as I learn.

Went for a walk along The Strand in Williamstown this morning, there were people everywhere with DSLRs taking pictures of the city at sunrise - it really made me want to pull the trigger!! The views were great, so they would have got some very nice photos.

Just to muddy the waters, someone has offered me a second hand D60, with a new Nikon 18-105mm f3.5-5.6 lens & a spare battery for $350. Is that a good deal, or should I wait until I have enough for the D5100 & a 18-200mm?

Thanks again.

Neil

[ameerat42]

Have a bit of a look at this review by DPR (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/NikonD60/)

It's a 2008 model camera, so a bit old in technology... (like, no Live View and no Video mode, to state the obvious)...

It may well be worth the money, but how useful will it be to you is the Q.

You haven't muddied the waters so much, just that I don't know enough about the setup.
Am.

[Doc63]

Have a bit of a look at this review by DPR (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/NikonD60/)

It's a 2008 model camera, so a bit old in technology... (like, no Live View and no Video mode, to state the obvious)...

It may well be worth the money, but how useful will it be to you is the Q.

You haven't muddied the waters so much, just that I don't know enough about the setup.
Am.

Yeah, I noticed that it is an old model. I'm probably better off being patient & saving up for the D5100 & 18-200 lens, as was suggested. I'm getting itchy feet though!!!

- - - Updated - - -

....and speaking of lenses, I found the following Sigma & Tamron 18-200mm lenses. Is there much difference between the ones I have listed here? The only Nikon 18-200mm I could find was twice the price!!

Also, would a 18-270mm, like the Tamron below, give me more options than a 18-200?

Sigma 18-200mm f/3.5-6.3 DC
Sigma 18-200mm f3.5-6.3 DC OS HSM
Sigma 18-200mm f/.3.5-6.3 II DC OS HSM
Tamron AF 18-200mm F/3.5-6.3 XR Di II

Tamron AF 18-270mm F/3.5-6.3 Di II VC PZD

Regards

Neil

[arthurking83]

.....

Just to muddy the waters, someone has offered me a second hand D60, with a new Nikon 18-105mm f3.5-5.6 lens & a spare battery for $350. Is that a good deal, or should I wait until I have enough for the D5100 & a 18-200mm?

......

Not particularly! D60 is old hat tech, with many serious limitations from the camera body.

For that combo, I'd pay no more than $300, but realistically $250.

A quick spot check will find that a D60 with the twin lens kit may or may not sell for appox: $150 on ebay.

I say geddit!(at $300 or less) .. I know what it cost this person, and while the 18-105VR is a great kit lens, they're a dime'a'dozen product ... and ebay would net you those items for about $300 or so.

I wouldn't place too much emphasis at this stage on the currency of the technology, and those two items will give some good results to begin with.

If you get more interested in photography, the basic feature set of the D60 will be the perfect camera to weed out deficiencies of the camera body for your intended use.

That is, if you don't want or need compatibility with non CPU lenses, then why get a camera that gives you this feature. If you want(or need) a camera with mirror lockup, or an exposure delay feature, then look for that in the next camera purchase.

So at $300(hopefully less) ... then you should have some left over money to acquire a good tripod for landscape work, a wireless remote for controlling the camera, and a few other accessories to assist you in getting the exposures right from the camera.


How the future pans out beyond this point will become more clear as you understand more about how you end up using the camera.


my advice would be to get it.

[ameerat42]

Yes, Kym's POV has some merit, but, the main Q would still have to be: How good is the 2nd hand equipment? Will it cark it after a week?

Now, to the lenses.

I see from the Tamron site - http://www.tamron.com.au/di-ii18-270_b008.html - that the 18-270 has some impressive specs.
It will give you that little extra zoom over the others (1.35 larger maximum image, in fact, or about a third bigger). Its "macro" capability is 1:3.8 - modest!
But it does have image stabilisation. (Sometimes I wonder if it's a good or bad thing for "learning" to take steady pics, but now I would not go w/o it.)
AND, it is compact. I do not know about its IQ, but usually T has a good name there.

On this page - http://www.sigmaphoto.com/lenses/multi-purpose - note that Sigma also makes an 18-250.
Yes, a tad less max. mag. than the Tamron, but slightly better "macro" at 1:2.9.

Again, no idea of IQ, but usually not too bad.

Am.

[Doc63]

Yes, Kym's POV has some merit, but, the main Q would still have to be: How good is the 2nd hand equipment? Will it cark it after a week?

Now, to the lenses.

I see from the Tamron site - http://www.tamron.com.au/di-ii18-270_b008.html - that the 18-270 has some impressive specs.
It will give you that little extra zoom over the others (1.35 larger maximum image, in fact, or about a third bigger). Its "macro" capability is 1:3.8 - modest!
But it does have image stabilisation. (Sometimes I wonder if it's a good or bad thing for "learning" to take steady pics, but now I would not go w/o it.)
AND, it is compact. I do not know about its IQ, but usually T has a good name there.

On this page - http://www.sigmaphoto.com/lenses/multi-purpose - note that Sigma also makes an 18-250.
Yes, a tad less max. mag. than the Tamron, but slightly better "macro" at 1:2.9.

Again, no idea of IQ, but usually not too bad.

Am.

Yes, its always a bit of a risk buying something 2nd hand from someone you know - if it carks it, it can end up causing more problems than its worth. It may be a good deal, but I might err on the side of caution.

As for the Tamron 18-270 & Sigma 18-250, they are both just within my price range, so they are worth considering.

Neil

[ameerat42]

At this point I'll leave it to you ("Beaver!"). I can't say there is any real right or (w)rong.
Cheers, and let us know how you go. Both options are creditable.
When you consider it, (something less than) $350 these days... (I'll say no more!)
Am.

[ROA44]

When I bought my first DSLR I only knew of a rough price range I was comfortable with spending, went into a camera shop and asked a few questions without really knowing anything at all. Forgetting the debate about which brand. I purchased A kit of 1 camera body & 2 kit Lenses had I spent the time researching as you are doing I probably would not have bought a 2 lens kit. the combination I now in Heine site purchased, would have been a body & a better quality lens EG. something in the 90mm or 105mm f/2.8 macro. $900- $1300 approx depending where you buy and what make. There are a number of excellent lenses around in this class which are great general lenses that will last a life time if well looked after. All though you can still get some good shots from the kit lenses you would probably soon be wondering what lens to get next. If you want to extend the range of the lens you can then go to a TC lens without burn the pocket to much. Something like a good 90mm, 105mm f/2.8 are great for parties, scenic shots, portraits & holidays and in lower light conditions. This will give you time to practice & save for other equipment you may want to research & purchase later. Also look for lenses that can work on crop and full size sensor cameras so that you are not having to re buy later because you decide to change cameras. these are my thoughts looking back on what I now know. Hope this helps.

[Doc63]

Thanks for all the help & advice everyone. There are just so many choices & things to consider. I think I'll save my pennies & buy a new D5100 & 18-200mm or 18-250mm lens. It might take me a while longer to get there, but I think I'll be better off in the long run. And it will give me more time to research (and change my mind again!!).

Thanks

Neil

[fillum]

Doc you don't mention if you are willing to buy grey market (Hong Kong, etc), which (as extraball already mentioned) will generally be considerably cheaper than buying locally. If it was going to take me a while to save the money for what I wanted (eg 18-200mm), what I'd do is get the D5100 and 18-55mm kit lens as soon as I had the funds. (For example ~$490 including insured shipping from eGlobal). Yes the 18-55 will be redundant if you later get the 18-200, but it's not a huge investment over the price of the body alone (~$70 if buying grey). What it does do is allow you to get out and shooting much sooner. It also gives you a chance to give further thought to your full setup (for example once you get a bit of experience you might decide that the 70-300VR is a better option for you telephoto needs).

[This is Nikon-specific as that's all I know, but there should be similar options in the Canon camp. Also I've only checked eGlobal prices as they are usually very competitive, but do "shop" around].

I'm a fan of buying used to get started (that's what I did) but I think the D60 is too far behind the D5100 for the few hundred dollars you would save (for example the D5100 + 18-105mm is $670 including insured shipping from eGlobal). That extra $320 gets you a hell of a lot more camera (and warranty).


Good luck with it...


Cheers.

[arthurking83]

.......

I'm a fan of buying used to get started (that's what I did) but I think the D60 is too far behind the D5100 for the few hundred dollars you would save (for example the D5100 + 18-105mm is $670 including insured shipping from eGlobal). That extra $320 gets you a hell of a lot more camera (and warranty).


Good luck with it...


Cheers.


Then again the D5100 is just as far behind the D5200 in terms of both technology level and feature set as well. So to start off with, and keeping in mind the financial constraints and possible uses, I still reckon the D60+18-105mm, and then the 70-300mm VR would make an ideal beginner set for at least a year or so. In that time, the D5200 will drop to a more reasonable price as well.

So for an initial outlay of less than $800, you could have the D60+18-105mm+70-300mmm rather than the same gear costing with the D5100 costing closer to $1100!

Not sure if the OP has mentioned that they have a tripod(for landscapes), and obviously won't yet have any filters and other useful paraphernalia that can be important for some situations.

While the extra dynamic range can be dealt with relatively easily, the extra 5Mp of resolution of the D5100 compared to the D60 won't make much difference for someone that's only starting out.(ie. printing large).

Noted tho that the better high ISO quality of the D5100 will be a significant advantage compared to the D60, but in the genres listed by the OP, not particularly significant.

D5200 is currently sitting at about $750 on DWI's site .. it won't be too long before it drops into the $500-600 range.

Having used a D5100 and recently a D3200, to be honest they don't feel all that much of an improvement over the D70s, in terms of feel or performance .. particularly AF speed!
D7000 is another level tho, and the D5200 uses the same AF technology as the D7000, so one should reasonably expect the D5200 to offer a focus performance advantage.

If bird photography is one of the key forms of photography, then AF performance will become important. For this reason, I reckon that the D5100 will become a limitation sooner, rather than later for the OP.

[ROA44]

Another alternative would be to just get the body you decide on and just start with a good 35mm f1.8, $218 or 50mm f/1.4, $399 prime lens from ddp new, sure you wont have any zoom but depending on your finances you can then save up for the lens you do want and not be settling for a lower grade lens. These small lens are great quality & cheap but always good to have in your kit and can be obtained fairly easily from reputable camera shops that do second hand or ex-demo. This way at least you have something to start off with so you can start practicing, learning about the camera, posting and enjoying photography. As stated earlier I regret gowing the way I did & have since purchased a 35mm & sigma 120-400 still wish I had waited a bit longer & got the 150-500, as they say patience does pay.

[Doc63]

Doc you don't mention if you are willing to buy grey market (Hong Kong, etc), which (as extraball already mentioned) will generally be considerably cheaper than buying locally. If it was going to take me a while to save the money for what I wanted (eg 18-200mm), what I'd do is get the D5100 and 18-55mm kit lens as soon as I had the funds. (For example ~$490 including insured shipping from eGlobal). Yes the 18-55 will be redundant if you later get the 18-200, but it's not a huge investment over the price of the body alone (~$70 if buying grey). What it does do is allow you to get out and shooting much sooner. It also gives you a chance to give further thought to your full setup (for example once you get a bit of experience you might decide that the 70-300VR is a better option for you telephoto needs).

[This is Nikon-specific as that's all I know, but there should be similar options in the Canon camp. Also I've only checked eGlobal prices as they are usually very competitive, but do "shop" around].

I'm a fan of buying used to get started (that's what I did) but I think the D60 is too far behind the D5100 for the few hundred dollars you would save (for example the D5100 + 18-105mm is $670 including insured shipping from eGlobal). That extra $320 gets you a hell of a lot more camera (and warranty).


Good luck with it...


Cheers.

Well, buying Grey is an option I suppose. I've bought other things Grey, such as runners, Ipods etc, so a camera shouldnt be any different.

It would also give me time to get familiar with the camera, while I save enough for a 18-200 or 18-270 lens. I also need to save for a tripod as well - its never ending, isnt it?

I know it will take me a while to save for what I want, so its a matter of deciding whether to get the Grey Market D5100 & 18-55 (or the 2nd hand D60) now & start taking photos, or waiting until I have enough saved to get the 18-200 or 18-270. I also need to save for a good sturdy tripod as well, which I imagine I'll need for the 18-200 or 18-270 - its never ending, isnt it?


Neil

[Brettmc20]

As said above a 50mm 1.8 is cheap and it would be a great start to learning.

[Mark L]

Me thinks buying grey is OK. 'tis unlikely there will be a need for any warranty claim as quality control on cameras seems pretty good.
Just buy from any of the large grey sellers, some of who can be found here........http://www.ausphotography.net.au/forum/showthread.php?13499-Ausphotography-Site-Advertisers .... and if you click the link from AP Rick gets a little to help the AP finances.
I know decisions can seemingly take forever, just be happy with what you decide. If you're happy with your decision before you buy, you'll be happy with what you get.:confused013:th3:

[fillum]

its never ending, isnt it?You've only been here two weeks and your learning already :D

[NCHANT]

Good luck with the decision :)

I only started a year ago (in 3 weeks to be exact...) with Canon 600D twin lens kit (with a free 50mm ƒ1.8) - again I knew absolutely nothing at the time!
I quickly grew out of the 18-55 lens and mainly used the 50mm for a while as the image quality is awesome! I still use the 55-250mm lens as I have no quarrels with that, but a bit more reach would be handy.
But for landscapes, I found the 18-55mm wasn't quite wide enough - this is where you start wishing for more money.
So I got a 10-22mm second hand, best investment ever! Then I found the 50mm wasn't quite wide enough... so got a 40mm ƒ2.8 as well. Perfect little lens, and cheap too!

The only thing I need now is a 400mm+ lens, then I can cover off any situation. My mission now is to stop spending money haha, beware it gets addictive.

As someone else has mentioned, possibly getting the kit lenses to start with will get you out there shooting sooner, but as I found you will want to replace the glass. :)

[Tommo1965]

if I was starting right now..Id buy a D7000 with a AF 50mm 1.8..this lens can be had for about $100 grey..camera is $790 grey

the D7000 has the ability to use older screw focus type lenses that can be bought quite cheaply used online....it also has a great sensor even by today's standards

ive a screw drive Tamron lens , 24-135 F3.4 -5.6...a great sharp lens that sell for around $140 used ....you couldnt use that on a D5100 or D5200...also the D7000 is 100% viewfinder and a pentaprism rather than pentamirror viewfinder

[Doc63]

if I was starting right now..Id buy a D7000 with a AF 50mm 1.8..this lens can be had for about $100 grey..camera is $790 grey

the D7000 has the ability to use older screw focus type lenses that can be bought quite cheaply used online....it also has a great sensor even by today's standards

ive a screw drive Tamron lens , 24-135 F3.4 -5.6...a great sharp lens that sell for around $140 used ....you couldnt use that on a D5100 or D5200...also the D7000 is 100% viewfinder and a pentaprism rather than pentamirror viewfinder

I was originally thinking about the D7000, and was willing to wait until I had saved enough, but I thought it might be a bit much for a beginner to handle.

[arthurking83]

....... but I thought it might be a bit much for a beginner to handle.

No such camera exists.

They all work the same way, so making use of one, is the same process as it is for another model/brand.

What invariably happens is that the photographer outgrows a camera model(usually the lower end models) and wishes for an higher end model.

If you don't feel confident in using any of the usual manual/semi manual modes, the D7000 does have auto modes.

But in my brief playing with this camera in those auto modes, actually had me .... confused: .... I had no idea on why it chose the settings it did, and there was no way to stop it from choosing those settings.

I distinctly remember one time when I chose the Landscape mode to see what it did, and for the life of me, it chose some lunatic settings like 1/320s f/8 and ISO400 or ISO800.

Why it chose 1/320s and ISO400(as an example), and not 1/160s and ISO200 is beyond my ability to comprehend! Took me (and another experienced photographer) a good 10mins or so, to work out that we weren't going to work out how to lower ISO in this instance!
The idea of the exercise wasn't to capture the image, but more so to see what these auto program modes do.

Working out what settings to use for a particular instance is not rocket surgery ... there are tried and tested methods for ensuring that a decent image can be captured using predefined variables as your settings for the camera. If you follow those methods, you shouldn't go wrong.

If you can eventually end up with the D7000 as your first camera, then this is ideal. It's one of those cameras that is at a level that will take you a long time to outgrow it's ability.

[Tommo1965]

I was originally thinking about the D7000, and was willing to wait until I had saved enough, but I thought it might be a bit much for a beginner to handle.

Nah......as Arthur said...they are all basicly the same...and in a a month or two you will kick yourself for not going that small step further. The d7000 was about $1500 when it was released. ..its a absolute bargain for $790...and will allow you to grow into it..rather than being frustrated a little way down the track..anew d7100 is coming although im unsure the pricing..but I expect it to be around the $1500 mark
The d7000 is still a very good camera..

[Miyuki]

No such camera exists.

They all work the same way, so making use of one, is the same process as it is for another model/brand.

What invariably happens is that the photographer outgrows a camera model(usually the lower end models) and wishes for an higher end model.

If you don't feel confident in using any of the usual manual/semi manual modes, the D7000 does have auto modes...

I totally agree with what Arthur said.
Before I actually started learning how to take photos, I used my hubby's Nikon D3100 with 18-55mm (which came with the camera as a kit) for blogging and stuff. D3100 was ok, but I wanted a higher model once started learning photography to do more manual mode photos. I used my dad's D700 when I visited my parents, and that also pushed me to buy a new camera. I ended up buying D7000 in the end, and I'm happy with it. With D3100, auto mode is the main feature, and it has a help button for beginners...which is nice to start with, but when you actually start learning photography a bit more, you'd find higher models to be nicer to handle for more detailed settings and manual modes. So I'd recommend to save a bit more to get a higher model.

Apparently Nikon is launching D7100 soon. It will be around $1500. Way over your budget...but the price of D7000 may drop...or people may be selling their older DX cameras for upgrade. Just my thoughts :)

I am a newbie here, just like you. Hope this helps :)

[Epoc]

Have you considered 2nd hand? There are bargains to be had out there. Just over a week ago, I picked up a brand new D7000 with the kit 18-105 lens for $600. Admittedly you don't see many bargains like this, but they are out there if your prepared to look.

[ROA44]

I reckon just go for the best body you can think you can afford but leave enough for a good quality small lens eg 35 or 50 you will always need one and then save up for the rest. later you will want other stuff so if your one who can regularly put money away until you can get what you want next it's the best way remember you buy a big lens you need the mono & or tripod to go with it.

[Doc63]

I suppose it all comes down whether the extra cost of the D7000 is worth it for a beginner, or should I put that extra money into better lenses & sturdy tripod.

I was able to hold both of them today. The D5100 felt pretty light in comparison to the D7000, though the D7000 was comfortable to hold. I must say, I like the fold out screen on the D5100. Decisions, decisions !!!

[ameerat42]

Doc63. Time for a new thread, titled:
"DSLR & Lens advice."
Ha-ha-ha-m.

[Doc63]

Doc63. Time for a new thread, titled:
"DSLR & Lens advice."
Ha-ha-ha-m.

Your not kidding!!

Its been great though, i have really appreaciated all the responses & advice.

[Hayaku]

Not sure if you've bought a cam/lens yet, but in case you haven't just my two cents.

I don't think anyone has brought this up but have you actually tried holding the cam your thinking about? When I was choosing my cam I was picking between a 600d and a 60d. Went with the 60 because it just felt more comfortable for me and I knew I could handle the weight.

Someone told me before that you should be comfortable with your cam, especially if your gonna be bringing it everywhere you go. If it's too big/small or heavy for you, you might just leave it at home cause it's not comfortable for you.

[Doc63]

Not sure if you've bought a cam/lens yet, but in case you haven't just my two cents.

I don't think anyone has brought this up but have you actually tried holding the cam your thinking about? When I was choosing my cam I was picking between a 600d and a 60d. Went with the 60 because it just felt more comfortable for me and I knew I could handle the weight.

Someone told me before that you should be comfortable with your cam, especially if your gonna be bringing it everywhere you go. If it's too big/small or heavy for you, you might just leave it at home cause it's not comfortable for you.
Yes, I've held both the D5200 & D7000. While the D5200 was noticeably lighter, The D7000 felt better in my hands. I have long skinny fingers, and I think the D5200 felt a bit small where you grip with your right hand.

[Doc63]

Hi all,

Its been a long time since I posted, but I haven really had much to add until now.

I've decided to pull the trigger on a Canon 70D. I('m going down the Canon route because my daughter bought a Canon 700D with a 18-135 lens.

My question is, to start out, should I get the 70D with the 18-55 & 55-250 twin kit, so that we have 3 lenses between us, or is there a different kit that I would be better of getting.

Thanks

Neil

[ROA44]

What you decide to purchase in the end is up to you but how much you can afford to spend will determine what you can buy. But a good all rounder like a 24-70mm eg Tamron a bit dearer could be a good start along or a 35mm f/1.8 or 50mm f/1.8 and builds on what your daughter already has . These are good lenses but are lower in value but always handy to have. When you have considered a particular area of interest then you can start to be more specific with a particular lens and save the $'s to afford it in the mean time

[Doc63]

What you decide to purchase in the end is up to you but how much you can afford to spend will determine what you can buy. But a good all rounder like a 24-70mm eg Tamron a bit dearer could be a good start along or a 35mm f/1.8 or 50mm f/1.8 and builds on what your daughter already has . These are good lenses but are lower in value but always handy to have. When you have considered a particular area of interest then you can start to be more specific with a particular lens and save the $'s to afford it in the mean time

Budget constraints are certainly a factor at the moment.

As a beginner, I thought those two lenses would allow me to lean haw to use the camera, and decide what I'm really interested in photographing, while I save for better/more specific lenses.

[Mary Anne]

What Genre are you interested in shooting..
I knew what I wanted to shoot by time I got my first DSLR that's the reason I bought it as the P&S camera I had did not do what I wanted.

PS. Just looked at your first post seems its landscapes street and Birds you are interested in, those lenses are no good for Birds except in your backyard.
Wide angle lenses there are good third party ones around..

[Doc63]

What Genre are you interested in shooting..
I knew what I wanted to shoot by time I got my first DSLR that's the reason I bought it as the P&S camera I had did not do what I wanted.

PS. Just looked at your first post seems its landscapes street and Birds you are interested in, those lenses are no good for Birds except in your backyard.
Wide angle lenses there are good third party ones around..

Yeah, pretty much a bit of everything, Landscapes, Birds, Aeroplanes, Wildlife & Travel.

I thought the 55-250 would be enough for birds, but anything suitable would blow the budget at the moment.

I thought I could save up while learning.

[Mary Anne]

Yeah, pretty much a bit of everything, Landscapes, Birds, Aeroplanes, Wildlife & Travel.

I thought the 55-250 would be enough for birds, but anything suitable would blow the budget at the moment.

I thought I could save up while learning.

I can understand if you are on a budget and want to learn.. So all you want is a wide angle lens and a long angle lens for now so the twin lens kit should suit you fine.
It ok to say you can share lenses with your daughter, though best to have your own walk around lens 18-55mm as she may want to use hers at the same time.
Serious Birding you will want a longer lens than the 250mm. Whatever you choose you will have lots of fun learning..

[Doc63]

I can understand if you are on a budget and want to learn.. So all you want is a wide angle lens and a long angle lens for now so the twin lens kit should suit you fine.
It ok to say you can share lenses with your daughter, though best to have your own walk around lens 18-55mm as she may want to use hers at the same time.
Serious Birding you will want a longer lens than the 250mm. Whatever you choose you will have lots of fun learning..

Yes, the Daughter will definitely want to use her own lens if we are both using at the same time (even though Dad made a significant contribution to the purchase!!).

I was thinking of saving up for something likethe Sigma 120-400mm f/4.5-5.6 APO DG OS HSM or Sigma 150-500mm f/5.6-6.3 APO DG OS HSM for birding & wildlife. They are not to dear to save up for. Would either of those be suitable?

[Mary Anne]

The longer the better for Birding, they should be fine, we do have Members here that shoot with those two lenses and take great photos.

[Mark L]

So you've got 18-135 covered, so why worry with the 18-55, unless you both want to take the same photo at the same time. Get the 55-250 so you can swap and save, save for the Sigma lens.

[Doc63]

So you've got 18-135 covered, so why worry with the 18-55, unless you both want to take the same photo at the same time. Get the 55-250 so you can swap and save, save for the Sigma lens.

Yeah, I thought that would be doubling up a bit, but the kits are either the 18-55 on its own, or 18-55 + 55-250. There is no kit just with the 55-250, as for as I know.

As Mary Anne said, Daughter will want to use her own lens if we are out together.

Those two lenses arent all that expensive anyway. I think the twin kit is about $150 more than the single.

[ROA44]

Also check out some reputable camera shops that sell secondhand gear you may find something that fits your budget there.

[Doc63]

Well, the trigger was finally pulled on Friday night.

I got the Canon 70D with the 18-55 & 55-250 Kit lenses.

Now I just have to take some photographs to put on here for some CC.

Thanks to everyone of all of your advice. It certainly can be a bit daunting when your starting out - there is just so many choices.

Neil

[EverlastingMoments21]

I'm kinda in the same position as Doc63 but I've found a Nikon d5200 fairly cheap with 2 lenses for any beginner or intermediate to start out with know the Nikon D5300 has been released at $1,049.00 all Nikon DSLR'S under d5200 will come down in price so the Nikon D5200 with the 2 lenses @ $769.00 free postage is great start .
My question i want to adventually be able to do newborn,maternity and family and single portraits along with landscape and travel destinations do i invest in a 35mm and 50mm or just buy the 18-105mm as well to do macro with adventually .

EverlastingMoments21 (Tam)

[ricktas]

I'm kinda in the same position as Doc63 but I've found a Nikon d5200 fairly cheap with 2 lenses for any beginner or intermediate to start out with know the Nikon D5300 has been released at $1,049.00 all Nikon DSLR'S under d5200 will come down in price so the Nikon D5200 with the 2 lenses @ $769.00 free postage is great start .
My question i want to adventually be able to do newborn,maternity and family and single portraits along with landscape and travel destinations do i invest in a 35mm and 50mm or just buy the 18-105mm as well to do macro with adventually .

EverlastingMoments21 (Tam)

Portraits, landscapes and even travel often require different lenses. Just focus on learning how to take great photos for now. This hobby will get mighty expensive anyway. Learn how to use your camera and kit lenses, then once you understand how it all works, by then you will start to understand what constitutes a good portrait lens or a good landscape lens, and in the meantime start saving. The two lenses I use for portraiture cost nearly $2500 combined. My landscape lenses cost about the same.

[EverlastingMoments21]

Portraits, landscapes and even travel often require different lenses. Just focus on learning how to take great photos for now. This hobby will get mighty expensive anyway. Learn how to use your camera and kit lenses, then once you understand how it all works, by then you will start to understand what constitutes a good portrait lens or a good landscape lens, and in the meantime start saving. The two lenses I use for portraiture cost nearly $2500 combined. My landscape lenses cost about the same.
Ok thanks for that handy info im not spending a whole great deal on camera gear just enough to get me started and learning. Already have a tripod which helps

[MadMax1412]

To break it down as a generalisation for your needs...

Portrait? 50mm-105mm



If you were planning to take some family shots whilst out and about say on a picnic, would you take a zoom lens eg Nikkor 18-105mm or would you prefer to use a prime lens? If a prime lens, which would be better - 35mm or 50mm?

The only reason I ask is that I was speaking to a professional at a baby shooting stand at the shopping centre and they said they should portraits at 50mm, so I guess I'm wondering if having a dedicated prime lens would be worth it.

Thanks in advance.

[ricktas]

If you were planning to take some family shots whilst out and about say on a picnic, would you take a zoom lens eg Nikkor 18-105mm or would you prefer to use a prime lens? If a prime lens, which would be better - 35mm or 50mm?

The only reason I ask is that I was speaking to a professional at a baby shooting stand at the shopping centre and they said they should portraits at 50mm, so I guess I'm wondering if having a dedicated prime lens would be worth it.

Thanks in advance.

Shooting at a stand is easy. The baby is going to be exactly the same distance from the camera each time. Take a look at the Santa photos at stores. Often it is a young kid taking the photos. It is all setup and the camera is set to specific settings and on a tripod, framed up, ready to go. Probably the easiest portrait sessions ever...except for the screaming kids and the parents...hehe

But get away from that 'setup' and 50mm will not always be the best choice.

[arthurking83]

If you were planning to take some family shots whilst out and about say on a picnic, would you take a zoom lens eg Nikkor 18-105mm or would you prefer to use a prime lens? If a prime lens, which would be better - 35mm or 50mm?.....

Prime lenses can be fun to play with at such events, but I dare say you'd probably find it more limiting, than useful.

Take the zoom(a good lens too!)

If you had a prime lens as well, and could justify taking it along too, then by all means take that too, and use it where you feel it's appropriate to try something else.

[robmj65]

Tamron 17-50mm is a good choice for general landscapes

[ameerat42]

Tamron 17-50mm is a good choice for general landscapes

Though you may be right, or may have found it useful, some sort of qualification would help the OP, who is a Beginner,
rather than just the statement.

[arthurking83]

OK, I'll chime in with some then :p
Tammy 17-50/2.8 is ok for a general purpose all rounder lens.

Bokeh is at the acceptable level. Not overly fantastic, but not dreadful either. If you look hard enough you can see ugly bits tho.

As this lens is an equivalent 28mm FOV on an APS-C sensor, I think in many instances for landscapes can be considered narrow(or too long). The only reason for that is that wide is always fun.
That's a side issue tho.

The lens is sharp. My version was the original screw driven type and Tamron have made changes over the years. First to a motor drive type(for Nikon and maybe Pentax, as Canon have always had built in motors .. but someone may need to confirm this tho!)
I don't think they changed the optical formula from the earliest to the second generation, but they did for the VC version tho.
No experience with that VC model at all. Some say better, some reckon about the same.

[peter1929]

Hi Neil,

FYI.. there was the importer of Tameron lenses on ebay , selling x-display models at a very good price.
I grabbed a 18-200 unit for 120.00 , even sent express had it the next day from Sydney to Brisbane.
Unit was as new, still had original packing, + the nice rubber grip smell.

[ivans75]

i am also a beginner, can I suggest lens 50 mm f1.8? You will have fun with it. I have the 1.4 which I bought second hand. (found a good deal when i was looking for f1.8) for around $200 you will get a nice blur background with that lens. The 1.4 is said to be clearer but I cant see the difference. The only thing is that it can go bigger app than 1.8. I think shooting bird will require a more advanced equipment. You can take a shot of your kids, girlfriend, boyfriend dog, wild flowers, leaves, and the magic is, anything unsignificant when you look at them with your eyes will become beautiful when you take some shots with that lens

- - - Updated - - -

just realised this is a few years old thread, dunno if it is still relevant ;D:D

[Hawthy]

It's always relevant. Cheers. :-)


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